posted
ok im barley passing my alg 2 L2 (the dumber class) and i dont evne understand how any of this is really gonna matter in my pursuit of a career in installing/ working on stereos. am i jsut not able to see how it will yet? i already know the volume and the area calc so do i really need anything else that i wont get taught at a MECP training school ie: ritop in boston. bc if so then i wont really care if i barely pass it. its more becoming a hinderence of me b/c all my time having to get help with it out of school is time that i cant be learning on here. im in my junior year just as FYI. tell me how my alg 2 might come in to help me in the car stereo industry.
-------------------- 93 ford ranger STD CAB JBL 600.1 running an Elemental designs 10" A series in a .65 cu ft sealed box invert mounted between bucket seats pioneer 6300 HU alpine type R 6.5 components in modified doors. pioneer 2 channel amp for the components 50 sq ft of Second Skin : ) Posts: 373 | From: greenville NH | Registered: Oct 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
Math is one of the 2 most important classes you will ever take for car audio. I also suggest an AC/DC electrical/ electronics course at least. I know are wondering why I say math is so important so I will give you a few applications I come across daily:
Figuring speaker series/parallel impedence loads Determining speaker wire size Determining amp power wire size Determining appropriate fuse size Troubleshooting- short circuits, open circuits, etc Troubleshooting- voltage problems Sound- frequencies, harmonics, octaves, phase and applications and related problems Determining amp output power and current draw Understanding sound volume- db's and what they mean Sub enclosures- measuring, finding angles, finding volumes of simple and odd shapes, understanding tunings and resonance Understanding amp and speaker specs and how they work- Qtc, Qts, XMAX, Vas, Levc, BL, Fs, Slew rate, damping factor, THD, etc etc etc.
These are just a few off my head. I am in school for computer tech and have had math classes and AC/DC electrical and electronics/digital. These classes have helped me more as a professional installer than anything else short of my love of my job.
A lot of people don't like math but the trick is to find ways to apply it to what you are interested in. Thats what I did, though it wasnt always at the time I was in class. A lot of times I would be sitting in class bored but understanding I would need it sometime, then I would be at work or building something and would suddenly realize I could apply some of the knowledge from my classes directly to car audio. Every time that happened I would pay a little more attention and study harder and would learn even more that I could use in everyday life.
A lot of people take those classes and never use the information again. As a car installer I can say I use some form of pretty much everything I learn in school in some capacity every day and its really pretty cool. If you really like to install and really want to be good I recommend at least:
Algebra(which I suck at) Trigenometry/Geometry(If you ever plan on building boxes or anything else) Basic AC/DC and if you can Electronics and Digital(Beleive me these will save you a lot of time) At least Physics 1(Very much realated to all aspecs of audio/electrical)
posted
Any time you deal with an electrical (power amp, etc) or mechanical (speakers and boxes) system, you're going to have to know math, and there's really no way around it.
The Buzz pretty much hit all the important stuff that you want to be at least familier with. That baeing said, I've had 5 calculus classes and two more maths past that, and I still need to learn more to really understand how all this sound really works
Ash
-------------------- ****************************** ****************************** Posts: 1130 | From: Los Angeles, CA | Registered: Aug 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
Hate to say it buddy, but math was my most hated class too and I need to use it quite a bit in the car audio business, physics is real helpful too..... You'll see, apply yourself, I wish I did more.
-------------------- Team Custom Team Quake Team Powermaster Team Ascendant/Fi Posts: 505 | From: Canada | Registered: Oct 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
If you dont like math or cant do it installing is not the job for you unless your just an assistant who does manual laber for the knowladgeable installer because you will never be able to plan a sucsesfull instalation without extensive math skills and as you can see by this post not being able to spell is something you can get away with but work your ass off on that math cause you'll need it all
Posts: 112 | From: California | Registered: Nov 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
im not sayin that i want to get aorund using math in the installing. i unfortunatly typically learn by being brought through the process of things once or twice and being taught why and what im doin. i can more than deal with doin box calculations and ohm loads seem to not give me trouble yet but that may be b/c i havent done multiple sub systems, but those are things im hoping to learn @ ritop. will i learn these types of formulas and stuff at ritop/ car stero school?. i was planning on goin straight from my senior year right into schooling @ritop and this is my last required math class. i dont know anything about qts, qtc and things like that, but where do you learn things like that?? i kinda am hoping on eventually being able to open my own shop some day and sell am mix of not shhit decent stuff and serious high end things. where did all of you learn these things???
-------------------- 93 ford ranger STD CAB JBL 600.1 running an Elemental designs 10" A series in a .65 cu ft sealed box invert mounted between bucket seats pioneer 6300 HU alpine type R 6.5 components in modified doors. pioneer 2 channel amp for the components 50 sq ft of Second Skin : ) Posts: 373 | From: greenville NH | Registered: Oct 2002
| IP: Logged |
Reading and reasearching. I've been installing since I was about 12 or 13 Im 18now. Their was somedays Id come home and do nothing but read. I use to do peoples installs for free just so I could get the experience it's really went a long way. I made my first enclosure in the 8th grade and won some contest 4 8's 3 cubes sealed with purple carpet Posts: 366 | From: atl.ga | Registered: Dec 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
XdshrX thats exactly what im doing. i have been letting friends and some that i really dont know much come up and do indtalls for them. i only had issues on one thing and that was an alpine HU in a 96 monte still dont know why it didnt work. but im doin boxes. im building one for my brother, one for a freind and installing most of my bro's system. i got alot of exp in when i did mine un aided by my dad (hes a master electrician) where were you able to find info on QTC QTS ect??? laimens terms exlpinations
-------------------- 93 ford ranger STD CAB JBL 600.1 running an Elemental designs 10" A series in a .65 cu ft sealed box invert mounted between bucket seats pioneer 6300 HU alpine type R 6.5 components in modified doors. pioneer 2 channel amp for the components 50 sq ft of Second Skin : ) Posts: 373 | From: greenville NH | Registered: Oct 2002
| IP: Logged |
basic Theile/Small theory (this link is a very good explination in my opinion.. I wish I read this site instead of trying to figure it all out myself.. hehe) -
posted
there are also some very good forum (on this and other audio forums..) threads on tweaking/installing setups for SQ and SPL..
Posts: 358 | From: .. | Registered: Apr 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
Math is Power -- Anyone remember those billboards/commercials?
It does speak the truth. I had algebra I back when I was 9th grade and I absolutely sucked at it. Next came geometry which I was slightly better at. I had pre-calc in my senior year which I remained at the same level of compentence.
I had to take Calculus I 3x in college. First time I failed it (hurts the ole GPA, 0.0*5), second time I withdrew from the class. Then I took it a community college and it seemed easier. It was the same material. Something just clicked. After that, I had to take Calc2, Calc3, Linear Algebra and Differential Equations (that was a PAIN). Except for DiffEq, the other math classes seemed easier. Perhaps you are at a similar "math" point that I was? I can honestly say it gets easier.
I majored in computer science so I had to take a lot of math, and I knew this when I elected that as my major. There's a lot of math involved with programming in general. Computer sceience basically breaks down into BIG word problems. Math is your tool to solve them efficiently.
I can see a lot of physics and geometry being used in the car stereo field. Obviously simple algebra is also a necessicity. It's hard to calculate the port length if you can't "solve for x". Just stay at it, it should get easier with time/practice.
posted
I got lucky, math came natural to me. Like anything though, if you apply yourself you can learn it and become good at it. I suggest you really apply yourself now too, because math is commulative. Everything you learn now you will continue to use throughout your math career.
So, if you hate it now, learn to love it because there is a lot more
-------------------- Premier - DD - Vifa - Adire - Linear Power Posts: 414 | From: Grand Rapids, MI | Registered: Jan 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
i was thinking bout this in math class today while i was trying to pay attention but i still was lost. my teacher failst still to help most of the people who are actually goin to amount to something. nevermind the fact that the only thing that matters in the class is test and quiz grades. it sucks big time. im trying to love math but every time we go into new material the first thing i think of is if this will ever help ME out in the car stereo industry.
-------------------- 93 ford ranger STD CAB JBL 600.1 running an Elemental designs 10" A series in a .65 cu ft sealed box invert mounted between bucket seats pioneer 6300 HU alpine type R 6.5 components in modified doors. pioneer 2 channel amp for the components 50 sq ft of Second Skin : ) Posts: 373 | From: greenville NH | Registered: Oct 2002
| IP: Logged |
I excelled in those 2 and basically flunked out of Alg II. ( i swear it was like i missed the day that they covered something paramount to the comprehension of alg II. I just couldn't swing it but i could fly by class in Geom, the stuff was just natural to me. )
You may be 3D thinker....the long complicated word problems may not click for you .... but you can spin objects around in your head and keep the correct angle and virtually study it like a hologram ...you'll be considered 3D thinker...and flunking Alg II would not suprise me for a second.
My wife...exactly the opposite...horrible in Geom...and can cut through Alg II like a sword.. (2D thinker)
Flopping AlgII doesn't hurt me a bit...math is a part of my job...i design electric motors and gearboxes....
Keep trying though...makes college easier...looks better to have all the maths on your transcripts...
posted
Well I tell you one thing after reading this post I wouldn't hire you because what you have shown is that when things get really difficult instead of working harder you want to find an easy way around and you wonder "is this really necesary" that will hurt you as an installer that attitude so remember that and just get to work and turn this math thing around and kick that classes ass.
Posts: 112 | From: California | Registered: Nov 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
Josh, im not nessicarrily looking for the easy way around things. im just wondering how all of this math is helping me. i totally understand that there are many formulas you use in calc boxes port size displacement ect. im just looking to see if i really need to be worried bout the fact that im almost failing alg2 and yet im still getting most all of the concepts i have looked into about audio. dont diss me as an installer. i dont give up easily, i have a vision about how i want something to come out i will find a way to make that idea work. im not the type to run all my wires up the "easier" side of the car rather than rca + speaker on one side and the power on the other side. i think the case might be that im not really motivated enough in class b/c i cant see how it all will relate to me after H/S. one other thing. would i have enough math exp, ect... under my belt if i were to go get mecp certified right after H/S?? or would i need to take some math at the community tech school for a year or 2?
-------------------- 93 ford ranger STD CAB JBL 600.1 running an Elemental designs 10" A series in a .65 cu ft sealed box invert mounted between bucket seats pioneer 6300 HU alpine type R 6.5 components in modified doors. pioneer 2 channel amp for the components 50 sq ft of Second Skin : ) Posts: 373 | From: greenville NH | Registered: Oct 2002
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by audiokid: Josh, im not nessicarrily looking for the easy way around things. im just wondering how all of this math is helping me. i totally understand that there are many formulas you use in calc boxes port size displacement ect. im just looking to see if i really need to be worried bout the fact that im almost failing alg2 and yet im still getting most all of the concepts i have looked into about audio. dont diss me as an installer. i dont give up easily, i have a vision about how i want something to come out i will find a way to make that idea work. im not the type to run all my wires up the "easier" side of the car rather than rca + speaker on one side and the power on the other side. i think the case might be that im not really motivated enough in class b/c i cant see how it all will relate to me after H/S. one other thing. would i have enough math exp, ect... under my belt if i were to go get mecp certified right after H/S?? or would i need to take some math at the community tech school for a year or 2?
MECP will give you basic math for electrical circuits and that about it as math goes. Its really kind of a formality and being able to regurgitate the answers they want to hear. Do not plan for MECP to give you a great understanding of much more than very vague general concepts and guidelines. Not that Im against it but by the time I took the first MECP test I knew everything they asked and then some from my classes and my own studying. The fact you do not ace ALG II will not kill you as an installer. But it is very important that you learn as much as you can because there is a lot of it on every level. Try to get the concepts and at least know how to use them because a lot of it will come up at some point on the job. Some guys use more than others, but knowing how the stuff works will save you a lot of time in the future. No one here is trying to discourage you from trying and installing is not a big math test as we may be making it sound, but there are a lot of small and sometimes larger situations we come across on a daily basis that involves being able to take something (concept or formula) we know about algebra, geometry, trig and sometimes calc and apply it directly to a problem or project we are working on. Just do the best you can- I hate algebra(formulas) and am more of a conceptual thinker but I try to know enough to do what I need to accomplish in any situation.
[ 11-21-2002, 05:02 PM: Message edited by: The Buzz ]
posted
thanks buzz, any thoughts on schooling though. should i attempt to do trig next year?? i know the teacher who is doin it and he and i totally understand each other. i understand the way he teaches me as well. is it atleast worth a shot?? should i go to the community tech school and take a car electronics cousre 12+ 14v explinations? i no that they have one. what have all of you taken as far as math and courses that helped out alot in the Car audio industry?
-------------------- 93 ford ranger STD CAB JBL 600.1 running an Elemental designs 10" A series in a .65 cu ft sealed box invert mounted between bucket seats pioneer 6300 HU alpine type R 6.5 components in modified doors. pioneer 2 channel amp for the components 50 sq ft of Second Skin : ) Posts: 373 | From: greenville NH | Registered: Oct 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
The most common thing I have heard in my college classes:
"...and after you do that, it's just a matter of chugging through the algebra!"
Algebra is very very important....and it's the kind of thing that you have to learn one way: by doing it. Nothing better for getting algebra down than doing a LOT of examples. After awhile, it'll just come to you and after that you will not even ahve to really think about it, it's jsut like riding a bike Ash
-------------------- ****************************** ****************************** Posts: 1130 | From: Los Angeles, CA | Registered: Aug 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
i think one of my issues with doing lots of examples is that i will screw up somewhere in the middle of things and i will end up doin half of the problems wrong and i will end up reinforcing bad habits which is probably the worst thing possible. im my math class all we do is sit there for 10 hour while the teach lectures as us then he does porb 2 probs wityh the class then assigns like 50 prob for HW and if your doin it wrong you wont know b/c he only looks at the HW to make sure that yours doin it. he doenst correct it. so i think im just reinforcing most of my problems in my math therefore almost failing. im more than willing to keep trying but i think alot of it is that he assumes that we know everythign and he doesnt teach us anything he just explains it to us for an hour and expects us to absorb it for life.
-------------------- 93 ford ranger STD CAB JBL 600.1 running an Elemental designs 10" A series in a .65 cu ft sealed box invert mounted between bucket seats pioneer 6300 HU alpine type R 6.5 components in modified doors. pioneer 2 channel amp for the components 50 sq ft of Second Skin : ) Posts: 373 | From: greenville NH | Registered: Oct 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
obviously your teacher is not very good. This will be very common in your educational career the solution is find someone who really understands this stuff who your homies with and have them guide you through it.
Posts: 112 | From: California | Registered: Nov 2002
| IP: Logged |
![[Mad]](mad.gif)
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
![[Embarrassed]](redface.gif)
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
