posted
It seems to me that people can easily point out problems and complain about how things are done, but when their asked for a solution or answer to the problem they pointed out, they dont' have one.
I for one DO NOT have a solution. I do agree that something needs done. I do agree that price and power should be limited in the street divisions.
Every explanation or answer that has been given, sounds great to whoever posts it, but it has faults, problems or can not be easily and fairly enforced.
So in the mean time, let the dBDRA do what they think is best. Untill then, let us keep thinking of the right way to fix this issue and maybe someday we'll be able to use incorporate those ideas.
-------------------- See you in the lanes,
dBSteve Get Loud Productions LLC Posts: 8358 | From: Midwest | Registered: Aug 2000
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quote:Originally posted by Wayne Harris: Since we have limitations on the number of amps that can be used in the Street and Street Max divisions, it is important that we accurately count the number of amps that are actually being used.
For example, if a manufacturer takes 2 amps and bolts them together, then the new "amp" should count as 2 amps. This doesn't ban the amp, it just insures that it counts for what it really is.
I have a pretty good idea of which amps need to be added to this list. Now, I would like to hear from you.
Thanks in advance.
That sounds cool to me...
-------------------- Posts: 1074 | From: Ione, CA | Registered: Dec 2001
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I just have to add to this that 5000D is strapable! So how you consider this then, what is to 5000D's?? 1? 2? 4? 8? 16? amps??
No, it's just two 5000D's linked, and what is this? Most Superior amplifier on the earth at the moment...
In your opinion . A 5000D is 4 amplifiers, we all know what it is, you know what it is. Please quit playing dumb.
-------------------- "A computer lets you make more mistakes faster than any invention in human history--with the possible exceptions of handguns and tequila." - unknown
quote:NDMstang65 (9:54:55 PM): scottie gagged me once...
Posts: 7868 | From: Camdenton, Missouri, USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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Did you know that your normal (mojo and other chunglam's) 2000D are just a extented versions of a 1000D? Basicly it is 2 times 1000D in a single board.
Only thing that can be done at this moment is to ban "bolt together"-style amps. Like SPL Dynamics EXT-4000D and US Amps USA 6000. This is very easy to determine, we can see what amps are just bolted together.
However we cannot go and ban multi-board / multi power input / multi whatever amps. If we do this we will be in endless swamp of amp models to ban. They just cannot be listed. Where do we draw the line?
Just get rid of "bolt together"-amps and be done with it.
-------------------- Team LOUD - Jani SS1-2 164,4 dB's 2002 - 2004 European champion and loudest SS1-2 on the planet 2001 Street 3-4 European champion
posted
An orange has a finite amount of juice in it. No matter how hard or how many ways you squeeze it, there's only a given amount of juice in it.
Big amps such as the A6000 from JBL, were pretty much proven at finals to not work wonderfully in applications where a car is not running and has one battery. There simply wasn't enough juice to squeeze from the orange.
The power limitation for single-board monster amps is inherent with the limitation on battery size and the ruling that vehicles in street must run with the engine off.
As for cost - yes, to a degree we need to look at cost to the competitor. However, competition was started to help get retail and manufacturing businesses going, and keep them running.
If the focus is only on keeping cost down and only on the competitor, what reason do the retailers and manufacturers have to keep supporting dbDrag.
At the same time, the reason the suggestion to limit it to only-strappable amps has many flaws, and even contradicts the philosophy of keeping costs down for competitors. As mentioned - D2s aren't strappable - but they are among the most common and most cost-effective amps for "beginners". You can get one on ebay from around $250-350 most any day of the week. While that somewhat limits retailer participation in setting up a new competitor, it does keep the cost down.
All of this has got to be a balance between the interests of the retailers, competitors and manufacturers.
The rule as written makes sense. It is pretty easy to see when an amp has a cosmetic chassis wrapped around it to make it "one amp."
-------------------- When you find yourself standing in a hole and holding a shovel, stop digging.
Certified IASCA/idbl Judge ** 2002 IASCA SQ Points Champ ** IASCA Pro Street 601+ * USACi Pro 601+ * SLAP Pro Street 601+ ** Team Gates ** dBs Posts: 5428 | From: Orlando, Florida | Registered: May 2000
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posted
How about between the 60 day cut off and 30 day cut off we have a period where people can officially "protest" street amps to judges.
Then the judges will determine which amps are not allowed and at the 30 day mark they will release a list of amplifiers that may not be used at finals.
-------------------- Quietest member of Broken Silence Competition Club
Posts: 1587 | From: Springfield, MO | Registered: Oct 1999
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posted
John - any give orange still has a finite amount of juice. You can't suck more out than it's got to give - and with the battery limitations, there's still only so much to give.
-------------------- When you find yourself standing in a hole and holding a shovel, stop digging.
Certified IASCA/idbl Judge ** 2002 IASCA SQ Points Champ ** IASCA Pro Street 601+ * USACi Pro 601+ * SLAP Pro Street 601+ ** Team Gates ** dBs Posts: 5428 | From: Orlando, Florida | Registered: May 2000
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posted
Wayne, when do you expect that this issue will be solved? Clear set of rules must be written, or at least give examples of amps that are not allower and what are allowed.
Audiobahn A5000SPL ? - To me this looks like a one huge amp (even with the multiple board) Trutechnology SH-1 ? - Same here, one amp Soundstream 5000W ? - One amp, 2 channels. JBL Crown A6000GTI ? - One amp, 2 channels.
SPL Dynamics EXT4000D ? - This is 2 amps US Amps USA-6000 ? - Looks like 2 amps to me
-------------------- Team LOUD - Jani SS1-2 164,4 dB's 2002 - 2004 European champion and loudest SS1-2 on the planet 2001 Street 3-4 European champion
posted
The audiobahn has 4 boards stacked inside it from my understanding, the tru SH-1 is two of their H1 amps in the same case. The soundstream amp is obviously 2 identical boards sitting next to each other. The boards are perfectly symmetrical...
-------------------- "A computer lets you make more mistakes faster than any invention in human history--with the possible exceptions of handguns and tequila." - unknown
quote:NDMstang65 (9:54:55 PM): scottie gagged me once...
Posts: 7868 | From: Camdenton, Missouri, USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Broken Silence CC - Johnny: The soundstream amp is obviously 2 identical boards sitting next to each other. The boards are perfectly symmetrical...
Actually it is single board. 2 channels, symmetrical design. I belive this design is called "dual mono".
-------------------- Team LOUD - Jani SS1-2 164,4 dB's 2002 - 2004 European champion and loudest SS1-2 on the planet 2001 Street 3-4 European champion
quote:Originally posted by *Krisa*: John - any give orange still has a finite amount of juice. You can't suck more out than it's got to give - and with the battery limitations, there's still only so much to give.
A Stinger 1700 is 12V with an internal resistance of 3.5mOhms. With a 3.5mOhm load the battery will provide 10,286W. (6*6)/(3.5*10^-3)
The Stinger orange has more than 10,000W of juice.
quote:Originally posted by *Krisa*: John - any give orange still has a finite amount of juice. You can't suck more out than it's got to give - and with the battery limitations, there's still only so much to give.
A Stinger 1700 is 12V with an internal resistance of 3.5mOhms. With a 3.5mOhm load the battery will provide 10,286W. (6*6)/(3.5*10^-3)
The Stinger orange has more than 10,000W of juice.
You have no idea what you are talking about. Batteries are not rated in watts. Your math is incorrect, you also didn't take voltage drop into account, or the efficiency of an amp, or the resistance of the power wire, or the loss of the battery thru the terminals, or the loss thru heat dissipation, or several other things.
-------------------- "A computer lets you make more mistakes faster than any invention in human history--with the possible exceptions of handguns and tequila." - unknown
quote:NDMstang65 (9:54:55 PM): scottie gagged me once...
Posts: 7868 | From: Camdenton, Missouri, USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Broken Silence CC - Johnny:
quote:Originally posted by DD Cherokee:
quote:Originally posted by *Krisa*: John - any give orange still has a finite amount of juice. You can't suck more out than it's got to give - and with the battery limitations, there's still only so much to give.
A Stinger 1700 is 12V with an internal resistance of 3.5mOhms. With a 3.5mOhm load the battery will provide 10,286W. (6*6)/(3.5*10^-3)
The Stinger orange has more than 10,000W of juice.
You have no idea what you are talking about. Okay, Electrical Engineer Johnny.
Batteries are not rated in watts. But they are rated in voltage and internal resistance, enough information to derive watt output.
Your math is incorrect Show me where.
, you also didn't take voltage drop into account, I did, 6V
or the efficiency of an amp, or the resistance of the power wire, I am talking about a battery, but since you ask, multipy by 75% for amplifier inefficency, and use 4/0 wire with 6" length ~ less than a few watt loss
or the loss of the battery thru the terminals, or the loss thru heat dissipation, Included in internal resistance rating.
or several other things. such as? please explain. Lets see your math showing that I have no idea what i'm talking about. I believe you are not capeable of logical argument, however.
quote:Originally posted by Broken Silence CC - Johnny:
quote:Originally posted by DD Cherokee:
quote:Originally posted by *Krisa*: John - any give orange still has a finite amount of juice. You can't suck more out than it's got to give - and with the battery limitations, there's still only so much to give.
A Stinger 1700 is 12V with an internal resistance of 3.5mOhms. With a 3.5mOhm load the battery will provide 10,286W. (6*6)/(3.5*10^-3)
The Stinger orange has more than 10,000W of juice.
You have no idea what you are talking about. Okay, Electrical Engineer Johnny.
Batteries are not rated in watts. But they are rated in voltage and internal resistance, enough information to derive watt output.
Your math is incorrect Show me where.
, you also didn't take voltage drop into account, I did, 6V
or the efficiency of an amp, or the resistance of the power wire, I am talking about a battery, but since you ask, multipy by 75% for amplifier inefficency, and use 4/0 wire with 6" length ~ less than a few watt loss
Topic Closed
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