quote:Originally posted by trex160s: why not put a amp limit on each class let the quads stay ex 1 dvc 4 amp limit 1 quad 4 amp limit
I much prefer this option if the intent of banning quads is to limit the number of amps used.
Anyway time to order some recones for all my subs.
it doesnt matter if you limit the coils or not. instead of using 8 1500watt amps , people will just use bigger more costly amps. To replace the power loss. I would expect alot of companys to come out with 2500-5000 watt strapable amps for this year. So everything next year will cost the same . people will just have 4 really big amps vs 8 big ones.
I agree thats whats going to happen ether way if you limit coils or amps, people will just use bigger amps.
so why not just limit the amps and allow the use of quads. eg 4 amps per sub and allow quads. because it will have the same effect and not cause alot of people added expense in reconing all their woofer.
quote:Originally posted by downbytheriver: BAD CALL I DONT KNOW HOW THIS IS GOING TO HELP THE SPORT
now instead of RF, MTX, or Kicker having to sponsor ONE competitor with 48, 72, or 96 or whatever number of amps, they can sponsor 2 or 3 competitors on that SAME budget.
thats one way it will help!
trust me...NO manufacturer WANTS to build quads (they dont sell at the retail level) but right now they HAVE to just to stay competitive in dB Drag.
posted
Originally posted by Anthony: it doesnt matter if you limit the coils or not. instead of using 8 1500watt amps , people will just use bigger more costly amps. To replace the power loss. I would expect alot of companys to come out with 2500-5000 watt strapable amps for this year. So everything next year will cost the same . people will just have 4 really big amps vs 8 big ones.
I also believe that is what it will come down to... Getting more expensive amps ie JBL Crown or strapping multiple amps together. This very topic even crossed my mind, but it would have not affected the outcome.
-------------------- Kara Lucius TEAM THUNDERFORCE~ TEAM SUPERIOR SOUND~ TEAM GATES 2004 dB Drag Racing EX 2 World Champions 170.5dB 2004 Idbl Ult 2 World Champions 172.5 dB 2004 MECA X1 World Champions 166.1 dB (3000 watts of power, baby!! ) 2003 dB Drag Racing Ex 2 World Champions 169.5dB 2003 MECA X2 World Champions 170.4 dB Click Here to View My dB Dragster: Posts: 597 | From: Ada, OH | Registered: Aug 1999
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posted
If the intent was to limit amps then this was a bad way. There are amps out there that stack in the dozens, its only a matter of building them to work in car audio.
While it also will ease up on the cost of normal competitors vehicles more sponsored cars prob isn't a good thing for someone who has to pay to play.
I would also create a division for sponsored vehicles separate from non sponsored people.
But back on topic, in the long term this is a good thing that will open the door for not so sponsored competitors and its the worst thing you could drop on those who have to pay for the amps and recones
(I wouldn't mind limiting it to 1 amp per sub in all SS&EX and one to street in the next few years)
Its never been about the actual spl numbers but rather a fair and just competition that alot of people could afford that was consistant for everyone. Thats why no one freeked at Wayne when they saw their new score with the new meter...Because they new it was a good move for the dB Drag community.
My final thoughts on the quad coil ban -Long term=Very good provided no company releases those dreaded amps that parrallel together.
-Short term=Very bad, people need at least a year heads up on this rule.
-------------------- -Donald Hebig
-Saskatchewan dB Drag event promoter Posts: 1961 | From: Borden, Saskatchewan. Canada | Registered: Feb 2000
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posted
This is an excellent idea in my opinion. The "competitors will just get bigger amps" argument is ridiculous, as they can do just that currently WITH quads. Like Don, I would also like 1 to 2 amps per sub. Hell, I may even do some SS then.
-------------------- Obviously you don't know who we think we are. SBAudio
1.. who is to say that a competitor that recones there own speakers wont be using quad coils just parrell the coils under the dust cap to make a quad coil a dual coil
2.. if this done then who is doing to pay to have a woofer protested
3.. if the person that is protested doesnt have quads after tear down who is going to pay to have it reconed
[ 11-26-2003, 05:00 PM: Message edited by: Tom Orozco ]
Posts: 228 | From: Your distant future | Registered: Aug 2000
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posted
I don't compete in a class that uses quads but, to me it would seem that regardless of whether or not Quads could be used, companies are still going to make their amps bigger and bigger. Don't tell me if someone made a 4000watt strapable amp that people wouldn't get 8 of them to run per woofer, even if they wouldn't hold up for more than one run. I agree with Wayne and Mike on this, good ruling.
-------------------- KCG Team Maxxsonics Posts: 1425 | From: Centralia, IL | Registered: Apr 2001
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posted
We should change the name from DB Drag to DjBl drag. I can't afford Crowns. So I guess it's off to Iasca or Usac. This is B.S. We are supposed to be loud. Push the envelope watch it bend.
I have a feeling that this is due to some manufacturers. Doesn't sound like a desision that would be made without someone threatening funding somewhere.
What is this coming to????? I remember someonew saying where do we draw the line.........I guess right HERE.
-------------------- T3 Audio H.O. Alternators Team Soundstream 06 NW Champion
Posts: 2463 | From: A gravel pit in Iowa | Registered: Feb 2003
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quote:Originally posted by orphan440: I don't compete in a class that uses quads but, to me it would seem that regardless of whether or not Quads could be used, companies are still going to make their amps bigger and bigger. Don't tell me if someone made a 4000watt strapable amp that people wouldn't get 8 of them to run per woofer, even if they wouldn't hold up for more than one run. I agree with Wayne and Mike on this, good ruling.
I am going to agree with Wayne, Mike , and Kevin
Almost all companies make dual coils, now all these comapnies have a an equal shot in drag with their woofers.
SS and extreme compitiors can now spend half the amount of money on amps, Batteries (in theory), power wire, and the such. Now they have more money to go to shows and show off thier vehicle
If people run quads and internally wire them to a DVC, I don't see the big deal. The main issue is the number of leads for amps (reducing that number to half). I doubt most people were using quads to lower the load to an amp, rather to run 8 amps instaed of 4.
I see this ruling as a GOOD thing. Yes, it will cost some money for everyone to recone their quads...but hey sell some of your amps to cover the cost (bet you come out ahead )
Just my thoughts
-------------------- Chris TEAM B.Y.O.B. - "Bring Your Own Bass" 154.3 DB - JEEP WRANGLER!! (non-crx, non-crx box...thinking outside the box) 2003 DB DRAG WORLD FINALS - 4TH PLACE STREET B 2003 H-O ALTERNATORS STREET ROOKIE OF THE YEAR 2003 DB DRAG 3RD PLACE POINTS CHAMPION - 247 POINTS SAME CAR
Posts: 874 | From: Oklahoma City | Registered: Jan 2002
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posted
Well, the way i see it is that banning quads in SS and Ex classes is a bad move. Let me explain.
The whole purpose of DBDrag Racing is to have the loudest system in a car, period. Sound quality is not an issue, just plain loudness. To achieve that goal, competitors must have access to a class of equipements , wether woofer, amps, alternators, whatever, that will provide them the means to achieve this goal.
I do belive in this spirit that Quad coils woofers in SS and extreme is a piece of this much needed equipement. Of course we could go to DVC setup with 2 huge amps, but why not go with a quad coil with 4 of those huge amps. The fact remains that yes money is an object, and personnaly i try to do the best with what i''ve got. And yes i'm a big fan of the "Let the install speak, not the equipement" theory. But there comes a time when your install is perfect, the only way to be more competitive, is to have more power.
An other fact is that it's much less expansive to have a quad woofer, and having say 8 strapped amps than to buy a DVC woofer and having 2 hell of amps powering it (say a GTI6000). Woofers are expensive for a few, monster amps are way too expensive for most...
Beside, having a quad is much more flexible to use in a daily driver, 'cause the high number of load combination you can have. (However that's an other story... Yes i think that QUAD don't belong to Street in DBDrag...)
Bottom line, i think that would be a bad move to remove quads in DBDrag.
I hope that Wayne, and the DBDrag Racing staff take a carefull look into this. That move could have a important impact on the future of DBDrag Racing, and since DBDrag Racing is the Lead runner in this sport, that could have a meaningfull impact on the sport altogether.
posted
Fantastic move, I really think it will help the sport because it will level off the playing feild....now you wont need tons of money to buy 8 amps.
-------------------- formaly known as Bassmecha
The Dukk says: Know your bass: PORT your damn box!!
[01:10] <wayne> I have decided (after a lot of consideration) that we must prohibit quad coil drivers. [01:10] <wayne> These speakers have no market relevance and they are hurting our sport. [01:11] <SPL2k> sounds great to me [01:11] <Shedluv> Wayne, be sure to email Chris McSweyn and Crossfire, he will bow down and thank you for it. [01:11] <SPL2k> lol [01:11] <wayne> I have already spoken with most of manufacturers (who make quads) and they are all grateful. [01:11] <SPL2k> all manufacturers will...the dont want to HAVE to build quads to be competitive [01:11] <wayne> They hate it. [01:11] <SPL2k> yep [01:12] <wayne> Also, to be competitive, most competitors needed to run quads. And quads require 8 amps per driver. [01:12] <Shedluv> I just remember that for a while Crossfire was leading the "ban quads" brigade [01:12] <klucius> i guess, i will need some recones.. i wanted to try 8 amps anyhow... [01:13] <wayne> It is so expensive to use quads. And, retailers don't really sale them. We must use Off the Shelf components in order to regain retail and manufacturer support.
-------------------- See you in the lanes,
dBSteve Get Loud Productions LLC Posts: 8436 | From: Midwest | Registered: Aug 2000
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posted
Hahahaha, sorry, I am so sorry, but I had to laugh when I read about the "shelf components".
Please all forgive me, but how much "shelf components" do we really see in dB drag leading cars??? (I count my cars in when I speak about "shelf components", maybe I am not a leader because of this...)
Hey, again from my own sight: I collectet three years every cent to have my stuff together for a SS3-4 car, or a SS 1-2 with backup equipment. After collecting 18 (16 needed) 9.0´s and collecting 8 Quad coil subs ( I am NOT SPONSORED by that companies ! Paid agood price, but still a LOT) I must cancel my plans. And again, mor money for more amps is not there anymore.
Maybe somebody find me a sponsor NOW?
Amps like the American Bass (or SPL Dynamics) have the BIGGEST Advantage now ! Cheap and Powerful ! Even a Crown has no chance against them ! But even cheap, buying 8 of the 4000 SPL Dynamics is still expensive. I cant start every year to buy stuff, or change my mind. I think, maybe some people will go away, but more others will come. Guess to what group I will belong...
Üüüühh!!! Michael
PS.: I accept whatever the final decsision is. Try my best to live with it and work with it. Nobody should be angry with anybody, when he decides to leave this sport.
PS.: Example : I have 4 amps with 4000 Watts each on one qvc sub = 16 K one sub. "Others" have 2 amps with 8000 Watts each on on dvc sub = 16 k one sub. If I can just use 2 amps on dvcs = Build better box for half power, or buy new amps = not with me.
*Head Judge at World finals 2004, 2006 and 2007 *Judge at World finals 2002 - 2003 *Norwegian dB Drag Racing Association. (NdBDRA) *Certified multi point judge.
posted
first off the people who are running quads, do not have 20k+ going to them. they have 10-16k, because they buy 1000d type amps. this is the stupidest thing that you could do wayne. i am sorry but you can get 8 1000ds cheaper than 1 6000gti, this being cheaper for the competitor is bs, if you run more than 20k to any driver, they will blow up, i know there aren't many competitors out there that actually do run a true 20k, because they don't want to keep replacing the subs. as long as manufacturers charge for recones, this is not a problem. i think you have just pissed off the west coast, most of the east coast, and even alot of midwest people by saying this. have fun next year with you sub 100 turnout at dbdrag finals wayne.
posted
This is a terrible move on the part of DB Drag. My team now has 9 quad coil woofers that are completely useless. Before you say, recone them, I will tell you it isn't possible! The DVC for our woofers, and most other woofers uses a different motor structure than a quad. Now instead of running our 4 non-strappable amps on quad coils (DEI 2400D) and having close to as much power as the bd1500's or mtx amps, we'll have to go out and buy big strappable amps to run on DVC's. I don't agree with the decision at all, and I think that more thought should be put into it. It is going to cost a lot of competitors, A LOT of money just to recone subs. Not everyone is sponsored by RF or MTX and has recone kits just laying around.
-------------------- "A computer lets you make more mistakes faster than any invention in human history--with the possible exceptions of handguns and tequila." - unknown
quote:NDMstang65 (9:54:55 PM): scottie gagged me once...
Posts: 7989 | From: Camdenton, Missouri, USA | Registered: Feb 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Tor Steinar Aamodt: YEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
No more Big Oki in the lanes
Just kidding
Hm, maybe I do change my opinion ! Just to bother some "nordic" people sometimes...
Am I kidding? Who knows...
And I always say, who cares about just a score? I can have fun anyways and be loud enough to qualify for world finals... Its easier ti have the sundays free to make pictures...
Üüüühh!!! Michael
PS.: Anyways, I didnt say that I am not in the lanes anymore. Just on the "world finals" lanes, but serious, who from europe did this 3 times in row? Hu? Who? Hu?
-------------------- www.sqpl.de I´m a Kraut,and I want it loud! Üüüühh!!!
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