posted
That most of us want a street 1 sub class and a superstreet 1 sub class but 1/2 are not willing to combind any of the higher ss and ex classes to make room for one....once again most people are too concerned with rules that will benifit them more than all of us at a whole......and no one can come up with a workable entry level real street class that we can all agree opon.....
-------------------- Team TAZM Team Gates Exotic Dreamz Car Club Team Cartunes
posted
Me me me me. I wanna win with the least effort.
I say open up a few more street classes for the majority of competitors and alow the smaller realworld setups a place to play.
Leave the SS the way it is.
Combine all the extreme classes and start offering huge dollars/trophys for prizes. I mean come on, its basically manufactures competing with each other and all the scores are pretty even across all the classes.
So what if you have less of a chance to win, work harder. So what if your product will have less of a chance to advertise a WR.
Lets raise the bar alittle. Were pros, we don't look for the easy way to win, we are supposed to be the diehards.
Class should not matter, only scores.
Thats only my opinion though.
No matter what is decided, we are all going to still compete.
-------------------- -Donald Hebig
-Saskatchewan dB Drag event promoter Posts: 1961 | From: Borden, Saskatchewan. Canada | Registered: Feb 2000
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quote:Originally posted by dB Don: Combine all the extreme classes and start offering huge dollars/trophys for prizes. I mean come on, its basically manufactures competing with each other and all the scores are pretty even across all the classes.
Sorry,I don't agree. I am building an extreme vehicle and I will probably have little to no manufacturer support. Why not? Because as of yet I am a nobody. Then why am I doing it? Because I want to! I am a professional fabricator by trade and I like to build stuff. I am not in it just to shill myself out for manufacturers. I want to win and I don't think the extreme classes need to be messed with. The only thing I see differently that needs to be done is SOMETHING to keep it a level playing field as far as interior is concerned. People are going too far overboard with extreme interiors. But...if rules don't change on this,I will most likely follow the rest of the crowd. It might be the only way I can be competitive,unfortunately.
-------------------- NICK T. TEAM TRENDSETTERS
If Mark Chapman would have aimed a little to the left,he would have been a hero Posts: 1690 | From: Lebanon, MO | Registered: Jan 2003
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quote:Originally posted by dB Don: Me me me me. I wanna win with the least effort.
I do agree with this,though. People get stupid sometimes with all the bitching about everyone else. "I shouldn't be in the same class as them because I don't have a CRX." "I don't think that floor cut is legal." "How am I supposed to compete with a guy with quad coils and strapped amps?"
Listening to this gets really old after a while. No one will be 100% happy 100% of the time. Simple as that.
-------------------- NICK T. TEAM TRENDSETTERS
If Mark Chapman would have aimed a little to the left,he would have been a hero Posts: 1690 | From: Lebanon, MO | Registered: Jan 2003
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posted
i have learned that no one is willing to regulate street enough for people to enter and do well. i am basically talking about getting rid of the 1 tuned track players in street, this is horrible for the new competitors who just start out. i feel since it is street, there should be a street system in there, and play music for a certain duration, like average 20 seconds of a 30 second run, and the head judge chooses the track. this will get rid of the huge score discrepencies from the street people that have 6000w and the new street people with 600w.
i compete in ss1-2, so do not think i am benefitting from this any way shape or form.
next we need to cater to the people with a bigger aftermarket system without a wall. yes i do see alot of sounddomain people with 6 12s and 4 15s in the back of their SUV, yet they are forced to compete in ss3-4 and ss5-8. we should change NW 1-2 to NW unlimited, throw what ever you can in there and run with it.
ss1 is a good idea, so far this is really the only added class. ss1-2 is a very stocked class as it is, and unlike ex-1, this will bring in slap and iasca competitors so there is not only 8 in each ss1 and ss2 class for finals. i have a feeling both will be close to full like 12-15 in each class for finals that legitimately have a good score.
it is true that we need to stiffen rules for competitors and not make them so vague, this does take alot of time and effort, but it is really up to DBDRA to make this a reality. i think all the finals judges should come together in a meeting of some sort of on the forum, and say what they all didn't like about finals, and see if they agree to change certain way things are judges, and do not be afraid to dq someone becaue they came from far away, or had to shell out this or that amount of money. seasoned competitors that do compete at finals know the rules. some choose to disobey them, they should be dqed, what about the competitors who do not disobey them, that is pretty much spitting in their face.
quote: In all this discusion, what have we learned?
That it's time for Wayne to break it down to 6-8 discussion threads that are going to matter and get on with it. Rules should be available before 2004 in my opinion.
Posts: 1674 | From: Michigan | Registered: Nov 2002
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quote: In all this discusion, what have we learned?
That it's time for Wayne to break it down to 6-8 discussion threads that are going to matter and get on with it. Rules should be available before 2004 in my opinion.
That would be a nice thing to happen...
-------------------- Team TAZM Team Gates Exotic Dreamz Car Club Team Cartunes
quote: In all this discusion, what have we learned?
That it's time for Wayne to break it down to 6-8 discussion threads that are going to matter and get on with it. Rules should be available before 2004 in my opinion.
yep I agree and out of those I suggest the following be looked at.
1. Podium, yes/no or allowing some kind of remote control of amps or RCA via a burp button etc. --- STREET 2. Classes what to change what not to change --- ALL CLASSES 3.Cut floors behind B-pillar??? yes/no --- WHICH CLASSES 4. Clarification on seating positiion and whats allowed?? --- EXTREME 5. Glass thickness restriction --- EXTREME
Thats my thoughts so far on topics I can think of.
-------------------- ---Member of Team Gates---
Don't knock it, if you know nothing about it. Posts: 3071 | From: Okla USA | Registered: May 1999
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quote: In all this discusion, what have we learned?
That it's time for Wayne to break it down to 6-8 discussion threads that are going to matter and get on with it. Rules should be available before 2004 in my opinion.
yep I agree and out of those I suggest the following be looked at.
1. Podium, yes/no or allowing some kind of remote control of amps or RCA via a burp button etc. --- STREET 2. Classes what to change what not to change --- ALL CLASSES 3.Cut floors behind B-pillar??? yes/no --- WHICH CLASSES 4. Clarification on seating positiion and whats allowed?? --- EXTREME 5. Glass thickness restriction --- EXTREME
Thats my thoughts so far on topics I can think of.
6. What would an entry level street class consist of & how do we keep it for the little guys?
-------------------- Team TAZM Team Gates Exotic Dreamz Car Club Team Cartunes
quote: In all this discusion, what have we learned?
That it's time for Wayne to break it down to 6-8 discussion threads that are going to matter and get on with it. Rules should be available before 2004 in my opinion.
yep I agree and out of those I suggest the following be looked at.
1. Podium, yes/no or allowing some kind of remote control of amps or RCA via a burp button etc. --- STREET 2. Classes what to change what not to change --- ALL CLASSES 3.Cut floors behind B-pillar??? yes/no --- WHICH CLASSES 4. Clarification on seating positiion and whats allowed?? --- EXTREME 5. Glass thickness restriction --- EXTREME
Thats my thoughts so far on topics I can think of.
the "folding seat" verbiage in the Street classes rules needs to be altered as it pertains to 3rd row seating. (see other thread)
-------------------- Andrew Harper
2002 STREET 3-4 6th Place World Finals 2003 Street B 2nd Place Spring Break Nationals Posts: 1702 | From: Vero Beach, FL | Registered: Jul 2001
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quote:Me me me me. I wanna win with the least effort.
quote:once again most people are too concerned with rules that will benifit them more than all of us at a whole......
Amen to that !
For Street: I think one thing that should be addressed is modern machines with heavily integrated, non-remote headunits. Its near impossible to add a remote ready after market HU to these vehicles in the stock position.
For Super Street: A 1 WALL class would make a nice addition, especially for those wanting to get their feet wet before diving in head first.
First. Everyone thinks that there should be a single sub class in street and superstreet because they want to either make it a cheaper class to run or they want to get people from other orgs that might come to db drags for this class.
Second. A lot of people want a very very cheap entry level class that replaces mini-street and gets invited to finals. Many of these same people have no idea how much the trip to finals actually costs. I want to see someone from the west coast who is spending $1500 on a system to drive/transport thier car to finals,spend $400 on hotels,spend money to go out and eat at finals, and transport their car back home and talk about entry level/cheap classes
Third. A lot of peple want to see rules that fit around a specific type of mod or car to be written.
Fourth. Many people that are talking about going to finals would never dream of taking their friends that they play football with and try to play against any professional teams. If they did get a chance to play against an NFL team I can bet they would be talking about how they lost to a superior team with better skills versus trying to change the rules in football to make it fair to themselves and their friends.
Fifth I have learned that there are 6 street/mini-street,4 Super-street,and 5 extreme class along with MS Cabrio,MS Berline and Mini Extreme classes in Belgium. Why do they have classes that we don't? And what are the MS classes? http://www.ice-mania.be/dBdragClasses.php
And last I have learned that there are a lot of good opinions out there and most of them do not look out for the best interest of Db Drags.
1. Let's see, no matter how you cut it, no matter what classes you come up with, someone with a giant budget will enter to dominate the class. Sure, let's create a street 1 class, where someone like me will literally crush anyone who comes out to compete locally. Why? because I have a much bigger budget than most 16 year olds who want to compete.
As much as it sucks, the only way anyone is ever going to create a class where new people can actually join and be competitive is by creating rules based on a massive database. As far as judging goes, having a database of amps, or subs, or whatever won't really be a big deal, it's just that nobody wants to put in the time and effort to do something that might actually really level the playing field. It takes no time, even on paper to browse a list of equipment.
I would happily donate a good portion of my time to physically writing this database if it meant getting more competitors into DbDrag.
2. A good 80% of competitors, regardless of class have built a system so far removed from an actual stereo it's laughable. At one point, this WAS about building a functional stereo. One that people actually listented to. This might be fine for extreme, but every year street systems draw closer to this. Having a system that'll play for 2 seconds at 1 tone is not something you use on the street, no matter what you tell yourself.
3. DbDrag rules currently favor certain types of cars, unintentional as it may be. Street favors tiny hatchbacks, super street favors minivans, and extreme favors full size vans. There are no current rules which even attempt to level the playing field between different types of vehicles in any class. Unless you specifically buy a vehicle for SPL, you can kiss any dreams of ever seeing the worlds goodbye, no matter what class you're in.
4. A great deal of serious competitors would rather find ways of exploiting the weaknesses in the current rules rather than following them. Every year more rules come out, and every year people find ways of bending a rule to it's limit in order to advance their position.
5. There is very little support for new competitors at shows. I'm guilty of this along with many other people. Instead of helping newbies make good decisions, we'd rather laugh at them, or cover our systems. Nobody learns if nobody teaches. There are many supportive people in this sport, but not enough. If you're afraid someone will swipe your super secret box design, or you just don't offer suggestions, what's the point in competing? If you have a design that is going to keep winning, how are you advancing?
6. A lot of serious competitors wouldn't be caught dead at a 1x event, where a lot of new competitors are. I have yet to see even one major player show up here for a local show. It's like going to a football game without seeing a single big name. It's the same people every show, and nobody there to really offer any really top notch advice. Chasing points is what drives a lot of serious competitors, and little or nothing happens to grow the sport.
I'm sorry if I've offended 95% of you, but this is my opinion on the topic. As I see it, if you want the sport to grow, you have to face some things you might not want to hear. If this post gets deleted, I won't be surprised.
quote:Originally posted by Nomex: What have I learned? 6. A lot of serious competitors wouldn't be caught dead at a 1x event, where a lot of new competitors are. I have yet to see even one major player show up here for a local show. It's like going to a football game without seeing a single big name. It's the same people every show, and nobody there to really offer any really top notch advice.
You need to come to a show in the midwest sometime. The big names are along side ALL other competitors doing what we all love. (...and yes,we have some pretty big names around here!)
-------------------- NICK T. TEAM TRENDSETTERS
If Mark Chapman would have aimed a little to the left,he would have been a hero Posts: 1690 | From: Lebanon, MO | Registered: Jan 2003
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quote: In all this discusion, what have we learned?
That it's time for Wayne to break it down to 6-8 discussion threads that are going to matter and get on with it. Rules should be available before 2004 in my opinion.
2X This sux If things go like last year we have to wait until AudioThunder is 1-1.5 months away before we can start to plan a setup That's not enough time IMO
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