posted
In reading the rules it seems to raise more questions.
1) What are the goals for this new format of competition? (What is the concept for it? Loudest vehicle? Loudest & Best Sounding vehicle?, etc.)
2) Why measure out of the driver's side of the vehicle? (This of course is directly affected by the goals for the competition)
3) If the measurement is outside of the vehicle, averaged from 20Hz-20kHz, averaged over 30 seconds... why put a 136dB limit on it (of course this is really loud but why a limit?)
Comments: If the goal is to bring this format of competition back to being about full range ability of the vehicle while maintaining the amplitude of SPL or Bass Race, then why measure out of one side of the vehicle?
If we are attempting to bring any new form of car audio competition back to a semi-realistic real world use case then the measurement would need to be somewhere centered to the vehicle. For example what is to prevent a competitor from designing a horn loaded enclosure that utilizes the driver's side front door opening then using the driver's side rear door opening for all of the mid-bass, mids and highs?
There is little real world application to that system, but it runs the possibility of scoring very well under the new rules.
It would seem to make a bit more sense to have the measurement behind the vehicle. This would provide competitors with a bit more incentive to build some form of real world vehicles, utilizing both front or both rear doors for mids and highs rather than just lining one side of the vehicle.
Of course please take this in the spirit it is intended, as constructive feedback. I do not know all of the discussion that has lead to this point.
The industry is truly waiting for a form of competition that maintains the excitement level, attracts the crowd and provides them with something that they see as a real world use case possibly influencing them for ideas on what they could potentially do in their vehicles...
I can't wait to see how this progresses.
-------------------- I'm so happy, Cuz today I found my friends, They're in my head. Posts: 130 | From: Melbourne, Australia | Registered: Jun 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Tor S Aamodt: BUT, Keep it SIMPLE, not to advanced...
We are in the same page!
We have been doing this kind of competition in South America for several years but not giving the points for the RTA, so it should work great in the US and the rest of the world.
Yes... By keeping this SIMPLE we will get alot of competitors that we have never seen before.
Nothing bad about USACI, EMMA or IASCA, but its way to difficult for "normal street beaters"
-------------------- Tor Aamodt
*Head Judge at World finals 2004, 2006 and 2007 *Judge at World finals 2002 - 2003 *Norwegian dB Drag Racing Association. (NdBDRA) *Certified multi point judge.
quote:Originally posted by Scott Neill: In reading the rules it seems to raise more questions.
1) What are the goals for this new format of competition? (What is the concept for it? Loudest vehicle? Loudest & Best Sounding vehicle?, etc.)
2) Why measure out of the driver's side of the vehicle? (This of course is directly affected by the goals for the competition)
3) If the measurement is outside of the vehicle, averaged from 20Hz-20kHz, averaged over 30 seconds... why put a 136dB limit on it (of course this is really loud but why a limit?)
Comments: If the goal is to bring this format of competition back to being about full range ability of the vehicle while maintaining the amplitude of SPL or Bass Race, then why measure out of one side of the vehicle?
If we are attempting to bring any new form of car audio competition back to a semi-realistic real world use case then the measurement would need to be somewhere centered to the vehicle. For example what is to prevent a competitor from designing a horn loaded enclosure that utilizes the driver's side front door opening then using the driver's side rear door opening for all of the mid-bass, mids and highs?
There is little real world application to that system, but it runs the possibility of scoring very well under the new rules.
It would seem to make a bit more sense to have the measurement behind the vehicle. This would provide competitors with a bit more incentive to build some form of real world vehicles, utilizing both front or both rear doors for mids and highs rather than just lining one side of the vehicle.
Of course please take this in the spirit it is intended, as constructive feedback. I do not know all of the discussion that has lead to this point.
The industry is truly waiting for a form of competition that maintains the excitement level, attracts the crowd and provides them with something that they see as a real world use case possibly influencing them for ideas on what they could potentially do in their vehicles...
I can't wait to see how this progresses.
There is a loophole for everything, I could build a cheater(lol) setup for your meter behind car idea with a large hatchback vehicle facing everything out the back. Ten feet in front of front bumper would be better but also has no real point its just a choice like the already made one of being 10ft from driver door. There isn't a perfect answer for every rule and picking it apart isn't the point. Drawing more people that don't already compete in dbdrag/bass race is the idea as stated before by a judge.
-------------------- Steven Tyler integra 2006 WF 2nd place 129.9 bassrace JVC Arsenal KD-AHD39 HD Radio/CD Receiver Alpine type-X comps Havn't picked out the amps or subs yet. All on the way soon to be installed
posted
Wayne my only concern so far is the 12 volt only rule. This will really, really limit cross-overs from the normal DB Drag guys. I mean think about it an extreme car with a good RTA score. LUNDY
-------------------- Art's Sound Chamber II 63 MAFIA "BRSOOE" Graduate & Sometimes Instructor! Posts: 641 | From: Midwest | Registered: Dec 2000
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posted
it seems cool as hell, but its just not for me.
its seems very interesting, but i just cant imagine anything even coming close to the rush i get from bass race.
im sure that there are alot of people out there who will love it, and who knows, i may decide to try it one day, but for now, im 100% bass racer.
i hope this works out well, and i look forward to seeing it in action soon!
-------------------- -------- 2008 - IM BACK!!!!!!! 120-129.9!!!!!!! -------- Only multi-season competitor with a perfect score at every event attended. -------- 4th place 130-139.9 world finals '06 -------- 2006 nopi nationals 130-139.9 champ! -------- team kicker -------- team xtreme disturbance -------- Posts: 1698 | From: Metter Ga | Registered: Sep 2006
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posted
Is there any way to cap the voltage at like just a little over 14.4 or something? Some people like me run a 14v set up, It rests at about 14.3 to 14.5. I dont know if its for me but I know a guy that is a expert here in town about SQ. So I will get up with him and see if its something we can build.
-------------------- TEAM SOUNDSTREAM BASS RACE 06 World Finals Bass Race 6th IASCA World Champion, New World Record 170.1 04 2nd Springbreak Nationals 06 2nd DB Drag World Finals 04 2nd IASCA World Finals 03 9 Al ST. Records Posts: 7486 | From: Dothan Al. | Registered: Mar 2004
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quote:Originally posted by LowFreq: There is a loophole for everything, I could build a cheater(lol) setup for your meter behind car idea with a large hatchback vehicle facing everything out the back. Ten feet in front of front bumper would be better but also has no real point its just a choice like the already made one of being 10ft from driver door. There isn't a perfect answer for every rule and picking it apart isn't the point. Drawing more people that don't already compete in dbdrag/bass race is the idea as stated before by a judge.
My point wasn't so much to do with the fact that almost anything has a loophole, it was more to do with attempting to attract larger crowds to these type of events.
Currently if you look at attendance at it is generally comprised of car audio enthusiasts. While this is great it is not growing our sport. The true way to grow the sport is to attract NEW people to it.
The problem is that by building vehicles that have little to do with a 'real world' scenario the general public just can't grasp it. Now by playing music the public will get it instantly, but they will inevitably ask the question...
"Why is all thew sound coming out of one side of the car? I don't get it? Aren't you supposed to have speakers on both sides of the car?"
I fear that once again we will miss the opportunity to appeal to a much wider audience and truly grow the sport.
-------------------- I'm so happy, Cuz today I found my friends, They're in my head. Posts: 130 | From: Melbourne, Australia | Registered: Jun 2002
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posted
Maybe cool but not for me we are into spl and bass race
-------------------- TEAM Team Kinetik First year competing 2006 Made World Finals and placed 7th Maryland State St C Champ NSPL World Record Holder Pro1201-2400 154.5 db's Posts: 243 | From: Monrovia Md | Registered: Oct 2005
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i didnt realize you couldnt have your engine running. I dont like that rule. Whats so unsafe about the car running if its outside in the open? Anyone ever get hurt at a contest because the engine was running?
-------------------- Rockford Fosgate FiCarAudio Team PowerMaster
i didnt realize you couldnt have your engine running. I dont like that rule. Whats so unsafe about the car running if its outside in the open? Anyone ever get hurt at a contest because the engine was running?
exhaust would also interfere with RTA readings
-------------------- Posts: 6484 | From: Russellville AL | Registered: Nov 2002
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i didnt realize you couldnt have your engine running. I dont like that rule. Whats so unsafe about the car running if its outside in the open? Anyone ever get hurt at a contest because the engine was running?
posted
As I see it: Its another place for the pro's to compete and won't attract newbie competitors. As someone that has a limited understanding of system design, I am totally confused about how this format can be for anybody other then pro's with a termlab & rta meter. It will take to much testing. To me it seems like extreme SQ, with that in mind.
It's not something I can see building a car for but here are suggestions I have that would make it easier for some of us with non dB Drag and non-street class installs to try it.
Why test 10ft from the car? This seems to encorage the a$$h@les that drive us nuts in traffic and give car audio a bad rep. Test at the headrest, where your ears are when you are driving.
Cars need to be running, in any real installation the car is built to be used while driving. I have never understood why dB Drag is against this. If it's a liability issue why is ok in bassrace ,SS and EXT? Sorry, but the liability issue just doesn't ring true in my mind.
Why 12v only? It would only maake sense to let SS and extreme vehicles cross over. Not to mention 16v is legal in Pro Stock (USACI street classes)and SQ in USACI, both of which I plan to do this year. By limiting voltage to 12v you are stopping a ton of competitors from trying this format without rebuilding their systems.
Under Installation Judging
TBD = Upgraded battery properly mounted
If you are giving points for fuses, shouldn't the battery be properly mounted and vented?
TBD = balanced charging system IE: big enough charging system to cover system loads
What good is any real system that can't be used for more then a few seconds before you have to hook it up to a charger? This doesn't mean you need an upgraded alt either. With 136dB limit I don't think huge amps will be needed. If big amps are used the system should be balanced as it should in every system.
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