posted
5-2 All audio equipment must be (or have been) commercially available. The determination as to whether a product is (or was) commercially available shall be at the sole discretion of the dBDRA.
i'm not trying to start anything, just trying to get some clarifications. what exactly is the dbdrags definition of "commercially available"?
posted
Was the previous shocker audio post in reference to the subs Mike was building before finals for some people? Not saying they were special in any way? I dont know any details,just assuming. Or is it for all of his subs? I am using the Super 15's and they have been available for quite some time now. If a company builds a sub that isnt easy to get ahold of does that ban the rest of their lines they make that are available to everyone? Or is it just that particular product? Like the topic says, im just curious to see further into this.
-------------------- 4 Shocker signature 15's 16 MTX 1000D's All packed in a really heavy Astro Posts: 403 | From: Spokane Wa USA | Registered: Jun 1999
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quote:Originally posted by dBSteve: im sure this will be covered in the 2002 rules.
and those will be out when???
if i'm not going to be able to run certain brands of equipment, i need to figure out something else to do before i put too much time into this car.......
this ruling shouldn't be anything new, the old rules said it was the dbdrag's sole discretion on whether a product was commercially available. this would lead me to believe there was already some sort of criteria already in place, i'm just wondering what it was?
posted
Not speaking for Wayne........but I think he's talking about companies making just a few "special" subs/equipment for a couple "special"competitors and pricing them outrageous for other competitors or not even making then really avaliable for others to use.
For example how many ppl would buy $3000 subs 2 months ago and be selling them for less then $1000 today?? Sure makes ya wonder if they Really paid $3000
posted
If a competitor purchases or is given a "comercially available" product, like a sub, for instance and this person is either sponsored or a long time good competitor,and he has the company modify his 'commercially available" sub to either be an impedence that may be more desireable or have a different SPL, is it still a "commercially available" product? It is still available but not with the different configurations? Would it make a difference if the person paid to have this done? Also I know that USAmps was letting people know how to get rid of the protection circutry to run either a lower impedence or a higher voltage. And the are numerous other companies that this can be done to. Is this still commercially available? What if the competitor works for a manufacturer? They can do their own mods right there. How does dB Drag deal with that making sure their products are the real deal? Does dB Drag care? Or is this rule just put in so it can be Selectivly enforced. At Finals as I walked around the vendors booths I stopped at lighting Audio and asked the rep if they had anything bigger that a 15". In was told no. Only to see a competitor using a Lightning Audio 18"! Is that commercially available. I know RF makes an 18 and I know RF owns LA so is this some kind of hybrid crossbreed? I think that there needs to be some definate, clear cut, definition of COMERCIALLY AVAILABLE not just the "at the sole discretion of the dBDRA" cop out. But that is just my IMO!
quote:Originally posted by DodgeRam: Not speaking for Wayne........but I think he's talking about companies making just a few "special" subs/equipment for a couple "special"competitors and pricing them outrageous for other competitors or not even making then really avaliable for others to use.
For example how many ppl would buy $3000 subs 2 months ago and be selling them for less then $1000 today?? Sure makes ya wonder if they Really paid $3000
I am incined to wonder about those Zapco amps that many dealers didnt know about..
Many products have been used in the past that "probably" should not have been.
But the rules are there to be followed, be it good or bad. We voted on them, we live with them for the year.
-------------------- Jeff President, Sweet Sounds, Inc. Three (3) Time World Champions ('00,'00,'02) Eight (8) Time World Record Holders ('00,'01,'02,'03) www.SweetSounds.com
posted
yes, I agree that Shockers may sometimes be difficult to get ahold of (but definately not impossible), however if you wanna get picky the Lightning Audio 18" was NEVER sold to anyone other then Kyle Witherspoon...but it seems to me that Wayne owns 1/3 of Rockford Fosgate (as so part of LA as well)...so that must make it OK? you can't be too mad about people bending that rule when Waynes company itself blatently broke the rule.
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2008 Spring Break Nationals Street B Champion 153.2dB 2008 dBDrag North American Finals 3rd Place Street A 155.0dB
2 TF One 10" + 1 American Bass 1000.1 + Odyssey 1750 Posts: 2966 | From: Canada | Registered: Dec 2000
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quote:Originally posted by jaggy: I think the dBRA should ask companies to send a list of their products just few months before the finals.
if it aint on the list, you aint competiting.
jaggy
Actually, the "list" is already available. Just look in the CAR AUDIO AND ELECTRONICS magazine (Directory issues). This could be one way to determine what is commercially available. Or not.
quote:Originally posted by ShockingCanada: yes, I agree that Shockers may sometimes be difficult to get ahold of (but definately not impossible), however if you wanna get picky the Lightning Audio 18" was NEVER sold to anyone other then Kyle Witherspoon...but it seems to me that Wayne owns 1/3 of Rockford Fosgate (as so part of LA as well)...so that must make it OK? you can't be too mad about people bending that rule when Waynes company itself blatently broke the rule.
Ah yes, what's that smell? Smells like someone doesn't know what they are talking about..... hrm... Kyle had DD Beasts at finals. Check your fact before you start talking about someone, please.
-------------------- Alan Riley Art's Sound Chamber
Fifteen Time SPL World Champions-----26 SPL World Records DB Drag == IASCA == USACi == MECA
Our stats page Posts: 2542 | From: Moberly, MO USA | Registered: Jun 1999
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posted
I have a crazy Idea. This may sound a little bit off the wall. But why not let the MEMBERS of dbdrag vote on what they consider commercially available. And even if they want the clause in the rulebook. As I remember last years voting was very close on this issue. I believe within 1% wasnt it? Lets define what everyone wants and then there will be no agrueing. Its so simple.
Ben
-------------------- Ben Fisher igotbass@comcast.net
Posts: 750 | From: Pittsburgh PA, Grant Ave 126 | Registered: Nov 1999
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quote:Originally posted by MR. IGOTBASS: I have a crazy Idea. This may sound a little bit off the wall. But why not let the MEMBERS of dbdrag vote on what they consider commercially available. And even if they want the clause in the rulebook. As I remember last years voting was very close on this issue. I believe within 1% wasnt it? Lets define what everyone wants and then there will be no agrueing. Its so simple.
Ben
I like the idea of Wayne making up his own mind. He knows what the majority of the real members want, both retail, competitor, and manufacture members.
-------------------- Bobby Riley Art's Sound Chamber
Fifteen time SPL World Champions-----26 SPL World Records DB Drag == IASCA == USACi == MECA
Posts: 3485 | From: Retirement Village in Branson Missouri. | Registered: May 1999
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I like the idea of Wayne making up his own mind. He knows what the majority of the real members want, both retail, competitor, and manufacture members.
Wait, what is a Real Member. Just asking not to cause a fight. Im trying to be positive here by suggesting something. Dont be negitive Bob, lets let some other people see what they think.
-------------------- Ben Fisher igotbass@comcast.net
Posts: 750 | From: Pittsburgh PA, Grant Ave 126 | Registered: Nov 1999
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posted
personally I don't see the need for commercially avaialable equipment...I mean every competitor should be able to buy the stuff...like if I call zapco I should be able to easily get a 4kw but I don't expect stores to know about them...you kow what I mean...personally I would say that as long as it is the manufacterer doesn't turn people away when they want it I say it is okay...even if it isn't found in stores.
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2008 Spring Break Nationals Street B Champion 153.2dB 2008 dBDrag North American Finals 3rd Place Street A 155.0dB
2 TF One 10" + 1 American Bass 1000.1 + Odyssey 1750 Posts: 2966 | From: Canada | Registered: Dec 2000
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quote:Originally posted by ShockingCanada: yes, I agree that Shockers may sometimes be difficult to get ahold of (but definately not impossible), however if you wanna get picky the Lightning Audio 18" was NEVER sold to anyone other then Kyle Witherspoon...but it seems to me that Wayne owns 1/3 of Rockford Fosgate (as so part of LA as well)...so that must make it OK? you can't be too mad about people bending that rule when Waynes company itself blatently broke the rule.
The first thing i want to ask you is. I really dont think you ever looked inside of my truck at a show. So how do you no what im running. For everyone else out there you all no what i ran at finals.
(man some people)
-------------------- Kyle W. 2000,2005,2006 Db Drag World Champion
also, how long does it take for a company to update their website???????
before the finals Zapco's website had the Zapco c9 etc on there but no Zapco 4k, they could have put that on their website soo easily...i know some competitors had them for a long time but wanted to suprise everyone but its unfair on others if they dont know about this equipment or its too late for them to buy or if they even can't get it at all!!!
i haven't got anything against zapco im just using it as an example.
the internet is a big thing, and everyone using this forum and many db drag competitors use the internet, so why not make it compulsary that equipment must be shown and comapnies website before a certain deadline before finals...
keep if fair for all competitors!
jaggy
-------------------- Digital Designs...true to the source
Posts: 1959 | From: England, UK | Registered: Dec 2000
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posted
I also agree that there should be a deadline on new product introductions. For example, no new products 90 days prior to finals, or something like that. This will ensure that ALL competitors have an opportunity to use REAL products at the Finals if they so choose.
-------------------- "Keep it Loud and Make me Proud!"
Topic Closed
