posted
For quite some time I have believed that a significant philosophical change is needed in order to continue growing the organization. After CES, I am more committed than ever.
Challenge:
1. Identify the "normal" aftermarket products that auto sound retailers sell on a daily basis.
2. Create classes where these products can be competitive.
Benefits:
1. Potential for growth - By creating classes aimed at the vast majority of auto sound systems, more individuals will be inclined to compete because they can be competitive.
2. Cost - By creating classes that require only a small investment, more people will be inclined to participate.
3. Retail Enthusiasm - If a retailer can actually sell and install competitive products, he will be more inclined to host shows because it will drive sales.
4. Manufacturer Support - This will improve because of the increased sale of products.
Why should an approved equipment list be used?
Currently, only a handful of legitimate companies support dB Drag Racing. After speaking with these companies and others at CES, it became clear that we all agree on what the problems are and what needs to be done.
1. Problem #1 - Most legitimate retailers do not sell the products required to win in dB Drag Racing. Therefore, hosting a show generally doesn't result in an increase in sales.
2. Problem #2 - The cost required to be competitive in dB Drag Racing is too high for the vast majority of enthusiasts. Only a handful of "elite" contestants can afford to participate. Typically, these individuals received equipment or other compensation from sponsoring companies which, in turn, continues to hurt retail sales.
3. Problem #3 - The companies that benefit the most from dB Drag Racing do the least to support the organization. This is a "double-whammy" because the legitimate manufacturers that do support us pay for the "stage" that the others use as a marketing tool against the very supporters that make this all possible.
Objective:
The objective is to move towards a competition format that will only permit approved brands and specific models to compete within each class. This will insure that "real-world" products of similar performance are utilized in each class. It will also ensure that only those companies that support our growth benefit from their investment.
At CES, I spoke with practically all of the auto sound manufacturers in the North Hall. Every single company agreed with this analysis and wanted to be a part of the solution.
This year, we will be introducing a minimum of 2 new classes that will use this new methodology to classify contestants.
The class Matrix lists the new classes as Street Stock. The rules for this division is very limited (similar to the original 1995 dB Drag Racing rules.) More information on this division will be available shortly, including the list of participating manufacturers and the approved products that they sell.
[ 01-24-2008, 08:44 PM: Message edited by: Wayne Harris ]
-------------------- "Keep it Loud and Make me Proud!"
posted
wayne thats what is needed to help new comers this freestyle class isnt going to help anything it has no rules and new comers will return after they win and have to move up what good is that will they return after they win . you need to new classes with rules and use only product that bestbuy and local shops would sell, like 1200w amps and $200 subs like the old days you competed you could go to your local shop buy your amp and subs and compete at a show on saturday and you would be hooked and going back to the shop to ask them for help on how to get louder. you need to get the kids in high school back into it the ones that dont make tons of money and cant afford $10,000 to join db drag but can scrap up $800-$1000 and have fun at it with little income.
-------------------- TEAM420 TEAM KINETIK MAXXSONICS T3AUDIO BATCAP SS 1-2 3rd PLACE 2007 INDY "REGIONALS" 163.9db
posted
If you bring back the "move-up" rule what will be done to enforce it and keep people from doing like before and just passing the car onto to their g/f, family member friend, etc?
I agree with all you wrote, there does need to be something more baseline that allows locals and chance to be proud of what they have and not walk away with an ass whipping from someone running gear they have never heard of or could even afford.
Manufactures would need to step in and not "sponsor" people for these classes as well, ?Im not sure how that could be policed except by honesty of the manufacture which some wont be a problem while other tend to like grey areas.
-------------------- Scott Christensen Handle every situation like a dog.
If you can't eat it or hump it. Piss on it and walk away. Posts: 10540 | From: Victoria, TX | Registered: Nov 2001
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posted
i say you need to have bought it at a retail store only with proff that it was bought at a store not online call it retail only class you need to show proff at everyshow that it was bught at a store,
-------------------- TEAM420 TEAM KINETIK MAXXSONICS T3AUDIO BATCAP SS 1-2 3rd PLACE 2007 INDY "REGIONALS" 163.9db
quote:Originally posted by ---Navi---: If you bring back the "move-up" rule what will be done to enforce it and keep people from doing like before and just passing the car onto to their g/f, family member friend, etc?
I agree with all you wrote, there does need to be something more baseline that allows locals and chance to be proud of what they have and not walk away with an ass whipping from someone running gear they have never heard of or could even afford.
Manufactures would need to step in and not "sponsor" people for these classes as well, ?Im not sure how that could be policed except by honesty of the manufacture which some wont be a problem while other tend to like grey areas.
There would be no "move up" rule for these classes.
The Freestyle class is something different.
-------------------- "Keep it Loud and Make me Proud!"
this seems like the best idea i have read to date,but other than filling brackets at finals i don't see how any of the rule/class changes will effect growth. Ask any retailer,judge or event promoter how many guys come to play but never join and compete repeatedly because they will lose. There is a substantial amount im sure.
Leave them alone or change them whatever, but focus on freestyle. The big classes will grow if there is new blood,but there are no spectators or new competitors in the bleachers even at FINALS.
The bleachers are full of competitors that have been eliminated and/or are waiting for their class. Are there any spectators that aren't either related or friends with someone there? I think not.
Why not let the "freestyle competitors compete until they hit a certain threshold dB ? 150 for instance that is a good starting point.
Let them play in a class they fit into for as long as they like. Repeat customers=$
1 or 2 more small "freestyle" classes wont make too much difference hell it might make dbdrag bigger and we will have to do a whole week long finals or totally full brackets at many locations
If you have a custom car with lambo doors and a ccustom dash and doors your going to have a stereo it is just a natural hand in hand scenario.
If you have an air ride/hydro setup that makes it a "wall" car, or has multiple battery's you wont fit into ss but you will want to compete and im sure you will have a stereo.
These guys wont be loud and if they are, then they can move up to a real class with the big boys.
Alienating them does not promote the sport, the manufacturers, or the retail shops but guess where they spent $25k the retail shop getting equipment that is "real world" not uber spl equipment and not at a dbdrag event or on a membership to get in to the "members only" forum where the best of the best hang out.
YOU ARE DEFEATING THE WHOLE POINT
quote: 1. Potential for growth - By creating classes aimed at the vast majority of auto sound systems, more individuals will be inclined to compete because they can be competitive.
There is no growth if they compete once, win and quit because they are forced to move up.
Its pseudo growth.
Make freestyle a finals attending class that is aimed at custom cars "tuners" or whatever
This will get more magazine and tv spots and that equals money for dbdrag or at least free promotion. witch in turn gets people on the website or out at a show if they hear about and possibly competing buying memberships and meters
I can hear it now "look at the nice cars at dbdrag finals " or "look at that rust bucket 20 yr old crx leaking oil and has a donut on it with 2 mismatched body panels and no interior haha what a looser "
Support the people that will support you!
Show them something and somewhere to spend the millions they already do on car shows, customizing and performance parts every year.The custom market is huge tap it !!
Noise proves nothing. Often a hen who has merely laid an egg cackles as if she laid an asteroid. -- Mark Twain "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery" Posts: 491 | From: NORTHEAST | Registered: Jul 2007
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posted
I hate to say it but I will again.... Along with these 08 rule changes we need to have products that are competitive in the retail market be put against likewise equipment in the lanes.
Example: Competitor X's Street A Rockford system which he purchased for $2k against Competitor Y's Kicker Street A system he also purchased for $2K. (by system I mean Amp and subs)
Many of you have seen the faces of new competitors who do there first show with that 1000 watt D amp and two 10's only to get owned by a sponsored person with 10k amp and 2 10's. They are just overwhelmed with the defeat they decide to purchase engine performance upgrades instead of spending more on the install to get the next shows trophy.
You fix this problem then you fix the growth issue.
I would like to see some sort of published retail limit set on classes with dB Drag certified equipment that was confirmed readily available to anyone implemented. So it would not matter what you purchased the product for. This would need alot of work from manufactures,competitors and dB Drag to make it happen, it is possible and if done correctly would make it competitive not only for the people competing but would result in manufactures offering product at a better price publicly to get more volume sold.
I know you told me this would be next to impossible to make work but if we did make it work imagine the sudden climb in the volume of competitors we would see.
[ 01-24-2008, 10:15 PM: Message edited by: dB Don ]
-------------------- -Donald Hebig -Stetsom,DD,Powermaster,Macrom,EFX,Ride Rite,Pioneer,Kenwood,Interco SSR Swampers, Superlift -Life begins at 200 points Posts: 1917 | From: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan. Canada | Registered: Feb 2000
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quote:Originally posted by dB Don: I hate to say it but I will again.... Along with these 08 rule changes we need to have products that are competitive in the retail market be put against likewise equipment in the lanes.
Example: Competitor X's Street A Rockford system which he purchased for $2k against Competitor Y's Kicker Street A system he also purchased for $2K. (by system I mean Amp and subs) good post
Many of you have seen the faces of new competitors who do there first show with that 1000 watt D amp and two 10's only to get owned by a sponsored person with 10k amp and 2 10's. They are just overwhelmed with the defeat they decide to purchase engine performance upgrades instead of spending more on the install to get the next shows trophy.
You fix this problem then you fix the growth issue.
-------------------- TEAM420 TEAM KINETIK MAXXSONICS T3AUDIO BATCAP SS 1-2 3rd PLACE 2007 INDY "REGIONALS" 163.9db
posted
I like the ideas of these classes. It brings back something that I remember most fondly in the early years of competing.
Raffles!!
You can win something that you could ACTUALLY WIN WITH! Not win an amp and be mad you didn't win the 25ft roll of wire.
Will these classes have limited runs of wire also? It won't make sence if you have a $2000 system with 320 ft of 1/0 wire that retails for over $5 a foot ($1600 total)
-------------------- Just some thoughts from a nobody. Posts: 3622 | From: Lakewood,Ohio | Registered: Aug 2003
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posted
As long as manufacturers support dB Drag and get involved and work with the people who run dB drag, it would not be difficult to regulate certified equipment in the street stock class. If a manufacturer debuts a new amp, they would send 1 right from the production line to a certified dB drag amp tester. The amp tester will measure the amp and if it passes whatever limits are set, then it gets the dB Drag seal of approval which can then be used for marketing of the amp and a logo placed on the box. Also, if production qty will be a limit and price, a manufacturer that works with dB Drag can easily furnish proof of how many amps have been produced in a year and what they are selling at price wise.
So many other organizations such as NASCAR and NHRA regulate manufacturers parts and the cars themselves. It can be done here and it should be done here to make sure this thing can grow.
Working at a shop and being around this business for so many years, I always hear young enthusiats talk about their cars and equipment. I often times I hear someone gloating about their new amp, telling their buddies that it's a competition amp. What makes it a competition amp? I have heard that its because they saw it in a competition car, or its just a really big amp, or they saw it in a magazine. Whatever the reason, these "competition" amps are coveted. Now if dB Drag puts their seal of approval on a certain manufacturer's amp then a customer can walk into a shop and see that seal and truly buy a "competition" amp.
-------------------- Ed Lester, Team T3 Audio Team Maxxsonics Team Power Master Team Hooker Audio Team Second Skin Team RazorLite 4 time dB drag World Finalist. 2003, 2005, 2007, 2008 awsome guy at car audio stuff.
Technically astute
4 12" T3 Audio TSS V2s 1 HiFonics XXV Maxximus 8 Power Master D925s
Posts: 1650 | From: near Philly Pa | Registered: Dec 2006
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quote:Originally posted by lmanosteel875: As long as manufacturers support dB Drag and get involved and work with the people who run dB drag, it would not be difficult to regulate certified equipment in the street stock class. If a manufacturer debuts a new amp, they would send 1 right from the production line to a certified dB drag amp tester. The amp tester will measure the amp and if it passes whatever limits are set, then it gets the dB Drag seal of approval which can then be used for marketing of the amp and a logo placed on the box. Also, if production qty will be a limit and price, a manufacturer that works with dB Drag can easily furnish proof of how many amps have been produced in a year and what they are selling at price wise.
So many other organizations such as NASCAR and NHRA regulate manufacturers parts and the cars themselves. It can be done here and it should be done here to make sure this thing can grow.
Working at a shop and being around this business for so many years, I always hear young enthusiats talk about their cars and equipment. I often times I hear someone gloating about their new amp, telling their buddies that it's a competition amp. What makes it a competition amp? I have heard that its because they saw it in a competition car, or its just a really big amp, or they saw it in a magazine. Whatever the reason, these "competition" amps are coveted. Now if dB Drag puts their seal of approval on a certain manufacturer's amp then a customer can walk into a shop and see that seal and truly buy a "competition" amp.
wow well put Ed a true "competition amp" i like that
Noise proves nothing. Often a hen who has merely laid an egg cackles as if she laid an asteroid. -- Mark Twain "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery" Posts: 491 | From: NORTHEAST | Registered: Jul 2007
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posted
Suggestions that Jeff Brown asked me to post...
In Stock Street if they limit the power wire to two runs of 1/0 and limit battery size this will eliminate the need for an approved amp list. You can only run so big of an amp with these limitations.
An approved amp list is a good idea but over all will cause more problems then it helps. I looked up batteries under 700 in^3. Stinger/hawker 1700, kinetik 2000/1800 and optima yellow tops. You know these batteries are .5 db down from a 2150 or nsb 90 and with a limitation of two runs of 1/0 I think the most power you could get is about 2k maybe 2500k.
posted
Carlton, the power wire limitation and battery limitation are good suggestions.
The point of the approved list is because Wayne is looking to create beneficial working relations with manufacturers and retailers based on the products that they sell to the standard consumer. This class is NOT intended for the COMPETITION amplifiers and subwoofers. The hope for these classes is increasing Manufacturer support, encouraging retailers to host events that can be beneficial to their growth and sales, as well as introducing new competitors to the sport.
It will be up to the manufacturers and retailers to get involved as this will be beneficial to all parties, including dB Drag Racing and the current competitors.
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