posted
From my understanding of the rules I would say no. Because this is considered a "pocket". Dash needs to go straight down to the floor.
-------------------- Team Vogel 2002 Street 3-4 World Finalist 2004 Extreme 1 World Finalist 8th place Posts: 149 | From: Broken Arrow, OK | Registered: May 2002
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quote:Originally posted by avogel: From my understanding of the rules I would say no. Because this is considered a "pocket". Dash needs to go straight down to the floor.
Correct...
-------------------- Tor Aamodt
*Head Judge at World finals 2004, 2006 and 2007 *Judge at World finals 2002 - 2003 *Norwegian dB Drag Racing Association. (NdBDRA) *Certified multi point judge.
quote:Originally posted by avogel: From my understanding of the rules I would say no. Because this is considered a "pocket". Dash needs to go straight down to the floor.
Correct...
Tor, since you are a certified judge for dBDRA, could you point out the section of the rules which support your answer? Thank you.
PS. Do not misinterpret this as being in disagreement with your answer. Afterall, you have access to more information about the rules than I do. I simply would like a more solid evident of the situation.
*Head Judge at World finals 2004, 2006 and 2007 *Judge at World finals 2002 - 2003 *Norwegian dB Drag Racing Association. (NdBDRA) *Certified multi point judge.
We have discussed that competitors can add to the front of their dash AS LONG AS it still passes the 30" rod test and AS LONG AS there are no holes or areas that can trap the pressure to effect the mic. There also must be a noticeable trailing edge to the dash.
Ok as long as: 30" rod test passes no holes in the 'transition area no pockets to trap the pressure must have trailing edge to dash
The dash diagram in question, meets all of your criteria...
The 30" rod test can still be performed, There are no holes in the dash, there is not a pocket in the dash to trap the pressure, and the dash has a trailing edge.
Since the measuring equipment would be placed on the top side of the dash, the footwell indentation would have little (if any) effect on the sensor.
However, at the same token, I would consent that if the dash proposal would have been built as such...
...then it would not be allowed.
But, since your word (as an official judge) has more seniority than mine, I will refrain from dicussion any further. Thank you.
posted
Hmm. If those are not legal then foot wells are illegal. I have always though foot wells are still legal and I think there have been plenty of Extreme cars with foot wells competing this year too without any problems. But of course, when it is just a drawing it is hard to say anything for sure.
And we were not supposed to go and disagree, but we are still in disagreements about the extreme interiors and that doesn't seem to change anywhere.
I agree with Sid.
Posts: 575 | From: Finland | Registered: Feb 2001
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-07 The year off, only six 12" in a daily driven VW Vento/Jetta. -08 Student, selling everything! Posts: 1170 | From: Kalmar SWEDEN | Registered: Jan 2000
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posted
I was told that the dash had to go either strait to the floor or could slant forward. Just couldnt go backwards or its a "pocket". This is my understanding from when I talked to dbsteve about it. I would say that pic of Norris's van is not legal.
-------------------- Team Vogel 2002 Street 3-4 World Finalist 2004 Extreme 1 World Finalist 8th place Posts: 149 | From: Broken Arrow, OK | Registered: May 2002
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posted
In my mind, by "pockets" and stuff like that is meant... damn difficult for me to expain, but like when you watch the dash from the top. If there are holes, then those are pockets or something and those are not allowed.
But when you look the dash/front/firewall from side or in front, there can be for example footwells and those are not counted as pockets.
Hopefully someone can explain better. Steve ? I might of missed if we have agreed that footwells etc. are illegal, but I really doubt that. Then there would be lots of illegal extremes out there, right ?
Posts: 575 | From: Finland | Registered: Feb 2001
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posted
3-11e Competitors MAY construct a removable or flip-down panel(s) to cover the OEM foot wells.
Additional Guidelines:
·In the interest of safety, competitors are encouraged not to modify the vehicle’s OEM foot pedals (accelerator pedal, brake pedal, clutch, and parking brake).
-07 The year off, only six 12" in a daily driven VW Vento/Jetta. -08 Student, selling everything! Posts: 1170 | From: Kalmar SWEDEN | Registered: Jan 2000
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quote:Originally posted by Kim: 3-11e Competitors MAY construct a removable or flip-down panel(s) to cover the OEM foot wells.
Additional Guidelines:
·In the interest of safety, competitors are encouraged not to modify the vehicle’s OEM foot pedals (accelerator pedal, brake pedal, clutch, and parking brake).
I belive that Jani ment built footwells as in some older extremecars because of old sitting rule.
-------------------- 2004 European Champion SS 3-4 165,6dB 2003 European Champion SSNW 160,9dB's 2002 European Champion S1-2. 156,2dB's Posts: 270 | From: Helsinki, Finland | Registered: Jun 2002
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posted
Yep something like that. So if footwells - open space UNDER the dash - is considered a "pocket" or opening that is now suddenly illegal, then you could say you MUST build straight panels to cover them, starting from the trailing edge of the dash. And I don't think that is what we need.
Posts: 575 | From: Finland | Registered: Feb 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Kim: 3-11e Competitors MAY construct a removable or flip-down panel(s) to cover the OEM foot wells.
Additional Guidelines:
·In the interest of safety, competitors are encouraged not to modify the vehicle’s OEM foot pedals (accelerator pedal, brake pedal, clutch, and parking brake).
I belive that Jani ment built footwells as in some older extremecars because of old sitting rule.
What I mean is that it you DON`T have to have a foot well panels, and if you don´t have to have that, well then you can build like Mikko want´s... Our car look like this without our foot well cover: So now this is an "pocket" ?
-07 The year off, only six 12" in a daily driven VW Vento/Jetta. -08 Student, selling everything! Posts: 1170 | From: Kalmar SWEDEN | Registered: Jan 2000
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posted
Exactly Kim. Like I have been trying to say, openings under the dash should not be counted as those illegal pockets. Openings from top of the dash would be those illegal pockets.
Yet again, there seems to be different opinions about this.
Posts: 575 | From: Finland | Registered: Feb 2001
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quote:Originally posted by dbWarrior: How about this ? Is this ok because it is out side of transition area ?
I would guess no, its not legal.
That part of the dash wouldnt pass the 30 inch rod rule.
Ben
-------------------- Ben ----- www.EastCoastChoons.co.uk UK SS 1-2 NW Record Holder Team UK - Team ECC - Team RE - Team DD Posts: 2986 | From: Deepest Darkest Norfolk | Registered: Aug 2002
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posted
Dash does not have to pass 30" rod test. The rod test starts where the dashboard ends. This of course when the dashboard is within the rules (max 16"). In this case, the dash needs to go straight down from the trailing edge because it is out of the transition area. (I don't mean all the way down to the floor - allowing foot wells for example, but it can't curve forward because then it would not pass the rod test)
Or did Mikko mean the dash is over 16" ? (The broken line confuses a bit)
Or what do you mean Ben ? Which part of that wouldn't pass the rod test ?
Posts: 575 | From: Finland | Registered: Feb 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Jani U: Dash does not have to pass 30" rod test. The rod test starts where the dashboard ends. This of course when the dashboard is within the rules (max 16"). In this case, the dash needs to go straight down from the trailing edge because it is out of the transition area. (I don't mean all the way down to the floor - allowing foot wells for example, but it can't curve forward because then it would not pass the rod test)
Or did Mikko mean the dash is over 16" ? (The broken line confuses a bit)
Or what do you mean Ben ? Which part of that wouldn't pass the rod test ?
No, you are right Jani, I forgot that the dash could extend that far aslong as its 16 inch or under.
Ben
-------------------- Ben ----- www.EastCoastChoons.co.uk UK SS 1-2 NW Record Holder Team UK - Team ECC - Team RE - Team DD Posts: 2986 | From: Deepest Darkest Norfolk | Registered: Aug 2002
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posted
On the passenger side footwells are not needed since the normal seating rule is no longer in effect. So the dash should go strait to the floor on the passenger side. You do not have to cover the oem footpedals on the driver's side though.
-------------------- Team Vogel 2002 Street 3-4 World Finalist 2004 Extreme 1 World Finalist 8th place Posts: 149 | From: Broken Arrow, OK | Registered: May 2002
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