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Recently bought a new truck, and already made some nice kickpanels for 6-1/2's and tweets. The components are a low-end model from Altec Lansing, but sound very good. Midbass punch is also good. Power handling for midbass is lacking, though.
I decided to do Kicker Freeair 8's in the doors. I went all out on the doors - viscoelastic deadener and foam mat on inner + outer door skin, and rebuilt door panels. However, the output in a freeair configuration is not what I was hoping for. (midbass punch was non-existent, and only had a tad of sub-bass output).
I will eventually put subs in the truck, but I'm thinking about just using the 6-1/2's in the kicks for midbass and midrange, crossing them over from around 60 to 3k @ 24db/oct. My concern is, will 6-1/2's be enough to fill in the midbass? Also, can someone recommend a 6-1/2 mid/midbass that will handle 150w RMS down to 60Hz in these sealed kickpanels? Diamond? Focal?
I'm "infinitely baffled" over why the 8's didn't perform well in a freeair configuration - I was driving them with 250w each and they were moving quite a bit (and not wired out of phase) - but their output left much to be desired. Other people have used 8's in a freeair config. and swear by 'em. I may be able to build sealed enclosures for the 8's into/onto the doors, but doubt they would have enough airspace (0.3 ft^3 according to calculation). I'd stick with my current 6-1/2's and the 8's if I could get some decent output from the 8's.
Any suggestions?
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Posts: 95 | From: PA then IL then TX | Registered: Oct 1999
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I think someone on here had said something about "sealing" the door with foam (not expanding, but chair foam). That way air still moves, but it's slowed down considerably. This may help. dunno, sorry.
Kicker amps used to have a module on them that allowed you to set them up better for controlling IB subs. Made them hit as if they were in a box. This is according to literature, not exp.
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Anyone else? I just want to know if there is any hope for this freeair setup. I have had the same 8" midbass in small sealed door enclosures in my previous car, and they kicked butt. I have no objection to going through similar pains to fabricate sealed door enclosures again (but would rather not if it isn't necessary).
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Posts: 95 | From: PA then IL then TX | Registered: Oct 1999
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Is there any openings under the panels facing into the car? That might lose ya some.
Hmm.. They're moving but you're not getting enough "Punch" .. ? I'd borrow an EQ from someone and turn up the 100-120 slider a bit and see if that helps.. If it doesn't, I'd probably call Kicker and see what they say about door baffles... Which are, in almost all circumstances, un-ideal.
ShadowStar
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HEY! I'm looking for a CHEAP used Clarion Thunderdome.. Hook me up!
Posts: 2578 | From: Somewhere In the Northeast | Registered: May 1999
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My old Illusion Nd-8s are freeair and they got DOWN. Most of the time I didn't run the sub in my car.
6 1/2s aren't going to give you the thump 8s will. Keep the 8s in the doors and run the 6 1/2s 250-3K- that would be close. Or keep the 8s and do some nice Veritas horns under the dash.
Hell, when I had the 8s in my car, I didn't have any mat on the doors, just made a baffle, screwed it to the door panel, and screwed that to the door- sounded damn nice. Might just be the speakers, or the baffle/door is flexing a bit.
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Posts: 7866 | From: Charlotte,NC USA | Registered: May 1999
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Thanks for suggestions everyone! I'll do some EQ tweakin' this weekend (have a dual 30-band EQ in the system), and will also check for air leaks.
If neither help much, I'll scrap the door baffles and get started on sealed enclosures.
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Posts: 95 | From: PA then IL then TX | Registered: Oct 1999
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twuz thinking on the way in this morning. Would poly-fil help out? I like the baffle and reinforcement ideas alot.
Did a friend's car with IBs in the doors, but that was so darn long ago, argh. Was going to do that with the BII's rear hatch, but then wallet yelled at me....oy.
The eq idea by ss might be the easiest and quickest of them all, and if it works, cool!!
Good luck dude, sorry not able to help much more, but keep on posting ideas. One of them will work
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I got a jump-start on the weekend and did some EQ tweaking, to where I thought it was the best sound. Also checked for air leaks, which were minimal and not toward the inside of the cabin, and the door is fairly structurally sound. Some bass guitar notes sounded good, but in general, the pitch was high. Also, I could _feel_ the kickdrums and bass guitar, but they were not loud at all to the ear. As for synth. bass - well, forget about it. Pretty much everything still sounds like it's lacking definition. Gosh, IB sucks compared to a properly designed midbass enclosure, even if the woofers are dubbed as "freeair".
I'm going full speed ahead on sealed boxes for the doors (this gave me another idea of replacing the stock door light with a tube of neon, so going this route may be good in more ways than one...). Hope to have one door finished by end of weekend - will keep you posted.
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Posts: 95 | From: PA then IL then TX | Registered: Oct 1999
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, .3 ft3 is great- try jl 8wo's, they'll work great also look at solobaric 8's or rf xlc 8's. sealed will be best, but i run 2 solobaric 8's in each door of my camaro in an aperiodoc setup (going to do sealed instead). they work well, and play real deep, just not quite as loud as i want (with subs of, 133db). i tried just free air and i didn't work that well, so i used 2 layers of felt pad (door panels are glassed 3 layrs) stretched over door panel back. if you don't like the sound of the sealed panels, you may want to consider trying this. but if you can get .3 ft3 you should be pretty happy
------------------ Lee Rambler, Team WeeBee extreme 5-8 class Team RF Team TN
Posts: 867 | From: lancaster,pa usa | Registered: Mar 2000
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I have the kicker freeair 6.5's in my doors and they don't have near as much life to them as some other midbasses I've used. I don't really like them much. You might want to try listening so some others who have 8's in their doors. I'm going to switch to a different midbass ASAP.
------------------ Brian Hagensieker 93 Civic EX Team G Sounds
Posts: 614 | From: Anderson, In, USA | Registered: Jul 2000
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Lee - you are right on the money. I finished the passenger side door enclosure...it is around 1/3 ft^3 interior volume. I did a comparison with the freeair setup on the driver side and the sealed door box on the passenger side. Same xover freq, flat EQ setting, same wattage, etc. Turned the balance left and then right. The sealed box completely blows away the freeair setup by about 10dB in the midbass frequency range. I had to turn down the gain of upper midbass, partially due to the cabin transfer fc'n and partialy due to the smaller-than-optimal sealed enclosure volume. The sealed box output from around 50 to 100+ Hz is great and sounds quite good. With the JL 8W0 or similar, the result would probably have been better, but I'm not complaining
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Posts: 95 | From: PA then IL then TX | Registered: Oct 1999
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Excellent dude!!! Glad to hear that 1) the dudes helped you out and 2) the instal kicked!! That's what I love about this board, everyone helping each other out!
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