posted
Ok heres the plan, ID Horns under the dash, a set of ID 61/2s and a pair of ID 5/14s (thats one 51/4 and one 61/2 per kick), and some ID 8s in the doors.
Heres the questions:
1. Should I go with the CD1Pro Mini horns or the CD1E horns? Why?
2. Can the CS1.X crossover work for the CD1Pro horns?
3. What frequency would you low pass your 8s at?
4. Im thinking of crossing over the 51/4s at about 100 or 150 hz and the 61/2s at about 70 or 80 hz, what do you think.
5. Final question: Where can I find the Image Dynamics ID or IDQ 8" subs, and where can I purchase the CX mid ranges (the mids from the chameleon set)
Im planning on running 4 IDMAX 12s with 900 watts rms a piece.
Any replies would be greatly appreciated.
-------------------- Women are like subs...you gotta break em in before you start pounding them hard. Posts: 175 | From: madison, tn | Registered: Jun 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
I'm not too familiar with installing the ID horns, but EVERY horn install I've seen/heard only uses a horn and a midbass, usually an 8". I think you'd be running into imaging problems with that many drivers acting as a front stage... most of the time, less is better when it comes to the fornt stage... Just my two cents, though... Have fun...
-------------------- -Nakamichi CD 700 -A/D/S/ 346is (fronts, vertically bi-amped) -(2) Esoteric Audio E7152 amps (vertically bi-amped for fronts) -(1) Nakamichi PA-8001 (1000w @ 1 ohm) -(4)Soundstream Reference SS10RL Limited Edition subs running free-air (receiving @250W each) -(3)Lightening Audio capacitors:1 one farad (sub amps), two .25 farad (fronts) -AudioQuest 401 Series directional solid-core speaker cable -Monster Microlink interconnect cable -Monster 4 gauge power cable throughout -A s**tload of Scoche Accumat -Lots of spray foam to deaden/stiffen cavities in trunk and A pillars -Sonic bliss Posts: 79 | From: New Rochelle, NY | Registered: Dec 2000
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by kdiddy: Ok heres the plan, ID Horns under the dash, a set of ID 61/2s and a pair of ID 5/14s (thats one 51/4 and one 61/2 per kick), and some ID 8s in the doors.
Heres the questions:
1. Should I go with the CD1Pro Mini horns or the CD1E horns? Why?
2. Can the CS1.X crossover work for the CD1Pro horns?
3. What frequency would you low pass your 8s at?
4. Im thinking of crossing over the 51/4s at about 100 or 150 hz and the 61/2s at about 70 or 80 hz, what do you think.
5. Final question: Where can I find the Image Dynamics ID or IDQ 8" subs, and where can I purchase the CX mid ranges (the mids from the chameleon set)
Im planning on running 4 IDMAX 12s with 900 watts rms a piece.
Any replies would be greatly appreciated.
ok to many mids just do with the 8's, horns & 12s
-------------------- spydermann
Don't get caught in the WEB Gimmie some bass baby keep your XXX and others, MTX for me Is that me in the top 10 now?? Do you smell what the BASS is cooking... Posts: 6799 | From: cincinnati, oh, USA | Registered: Jun 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
So, a 61/2 for the mid range, 8" for mid bass and the horn for the highs. Sounds like the ticket so far, anymore opinions?
-------------------- Women are like subs...you gotta break em in before you start pounding them hard. Posts: 175 | From: madison, tn | Registered: Jun 2002
| IP: Logged |
If you can do the 3-way setup, then do it, it will be the best sounding of the options.
The IDQ-8s (which will be hard to find) will not like to play to 1-1.25k hertz where the horns will need to be crossed over at.
No, the passives will not work with the 1 Pros. The passives are a crossover for the midbasses and an EQ circuit for the 1e horns.
I'd run the 8s down to 40-45 hertz and up to 150 hertz or so if you can. My midranges are crossed at 200 hertz b/c that is the lowest that I can go on my processor.
In my personal IASCA car, I run a 3-way horn setup- as do most of the Team ID cars...and is the perfered way to do a serious SQ car. If it is a street car, then do the 6s or a pair of 6s in the doors and be done with it. But seeing the amount of bass you'll have...it's doubtful that it is a pure SQ car.
Not too many drivers. A 3 way set up would be alot more efficient than a 2 way.
Imaging problems...at the last show that I went to (SSR triple point show) I had near perfect imaging scores from the left to the right- 5, 5, 4, 5, 5. Staging I had a 9 in listeng position, 8 in height, and a 8 in width. I also place 9th in the inviational round on sunday out of 26 cars. Tonality was a 9 in subbass, 8 in midbass, 8 in midrange, and 7 in highs.
You guys really don't have too much experience with said setups.
-------------------- Team Image Dynamics/Zapco/Werewolf/JK Lab Team Kinetik Sick Bastard Audio SQ Who feels it knows it Posts: 7993 | From: Charlotte,NC USA | Registered: May 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
But the 4-way front end with the horns, 5s, 6s, AND 8s is needless. Do a 3-way with horns, 2 sets of 6s, or horns 5s and 8s.
-------------------- Team Image Dynamics/Zapco/Werewolf/JK Lab Team Kinetik Sick Bastard Audio SQ Who feels it knows it Posts: 7993 | From: Charlotte,NC USA | Registered: May 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
So would an HLCD component set along with some 8s be a good way to go? Or should I go with the Pro horns and buy the mids seperate, and bi amp them? What 8s would you recommend if I couldnt find the IDs? This set up is going to be for daily driving and competition. Im gonna be running two Orion XTR1400s and 4 IDMAXs. For SQ comps, Ill only be running one XTR on two of the maxs. But for street use, I want a SPL/SQ mix. Winslow, what are the main differences between the ID horns? The price is very obvious, then theres the efficiency rating and the power handling. But what are the differences in the sound? Which do you think would be best for my application? Oh and thanks to everyone for your help.
-------------------- Women are like subs...you gotta break em in before you start pounding them hard. Posts: 175 | From: madison, tn | Registered: Jun 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
First off, let me apologize for sounding like an ass in that last post....
The problem with doing a 2-way setup with the horns and 8s is finding an 8 that can play both the midrange and midbass the way it should...and do it in a reasonable sized enclosure. If I had to pick an 8 that would be able to do both pretty well, it would be the Seas Excel W21E001 or the JL Audio 8IB4...would need to be vented to the outside of the car- the Seas would need more of an AP style enclosure.
Another thing...you probably don't have an idea what you are asking from the front stage- to keep up with 4 Maxes, you will need: lots of power, high effeciency, and a cone area.
I haven't heard a set of 1es in about 6 years, so I can't really comment on those drivers...but I remember liking them. The 1Pros have the best topend of the ID drivers and will be the most compact of them as well. The CD2s have the midrange of the drivers, are the most effecient, and roll off hard above 14-16k hertz...it gives them a laid back sound...but they are LARGE HEAVY drivers, and would require welding brackets in the car to hold them...but they are my favorite drivers and I'm using them now.
-------------------- Team Image Dynamics/Zapco/Werewolf/JK Lab Team Kinetik Sick Bastard Audio SQ Who feels it knows it Posts: 7993 | From: Charlotte,NC USA | Registered: May 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
I know that I will need a really powerful front stage to keep up with the IDMAXs. Thats why im going with the horns. Im thinking the three way set up should be able to handle it. I havent really decided on my mid range drivers yet, I might stay all ID and go with the chameleon mids, but im leaning towards the focal utopia 6 1/2s. Not sure on the 8s yet. May try out the CD1E horns, the CD2s are a little bit more than I want to spend. As for power, I will be using an Orion XTR 500 for the horns, running at 8 ohms I should get roughly 65-80 watts rms to each horn. That may be too much power I heard, but they are rated at 60 watts rms I believe, so I'll start there. The mids and the 8s will be running off an Orion XTR 800.4. Thats around 100 watts rms a peice to the mids. Not sure what ohm load I'll get from the 8s yet because I dont know what subs I want yet. I dont think i would port to the out side of the vehicle, Im looking for a sub that would sound good sealed or in an infinite baffle situation. The three way set up will work out best I believe, I have dedicated drivers for highs, mids and mid bass, all amped seperatly. Only problem is picking out the drivers to use.
-------------------- Women are like subs...you gotta break em in before you start pounding them hard. Posts: 175 | From: madison, tn | Registered: Jun 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
if you don't have 8s picked out then look at some Dynaudio MW 170
-------------------- spydermann
Don't get caught in the WEB Gimmie some bass baby keep your XXX and others, MTX for me Is that me in the top 10 now?? Do you smell what the BASS is cooking... Posts: 6799 | From: cincinnati, oh, USA | Registered: Jun 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
Ive been told the dynaudio speakers were a little laid back for my application. I need SQ at high volumes.
-------------------- Women are like subs...you gotta break em in before you start pounding them hard. Posts: 175 | From: madison, tn | Registered: Jun 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
Since you are basically wanting to build a mobile PA system, why not look into some PA type midranges? PHL makes an 8" midrange.
-------------------- Team Image Dynamics/Zapco/Werewolf/JK Lab Team Kinetik Sick Bastard Audio SQ Who feels it knows it Posts: 7993 | From: Charlotte,NC USA | Registered: May 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
Haha, I wouldnt go that far, but close. I just like my music very loud and very clear. Not all of the time though, so I want my set up to have excellent SQ at moderate levels also. What are your takes on the Illusion 8s and the dynaudio 8s? Also, why do the CD1 Pro horns only handle 60 watts rms, while the other two horns made by ID handle 100 watts?
-------------------- Women are like subs...you gotta break em in before you start pounding them hard. Posts: 175 | From: madison, tn | Registered: Jun 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
The Illusions and Dyns as midbasses or midranges?
Well, I wouldn't worry about the RMS rating on the drivers since if you ever get anywhere close to that, you'll have to have ALOT more midbass and midrange to keep up...giving the CD2s a true 30 watts is enough to easily over power 8" midbasses and midranges.
-------------------- Team Image Dynamics/Zapco/Werewolf/JK Lab Team Kinetik Sick Bastard Audio SQ Who feels it knows it Posts: 7993 | From: Charlotte,NC USA | Registered: May 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
I've got ID CD2 Pro MH's and Dynaudio MW170s... They sound very good together. Like winslow said, the horns can easily overpower the midbass's... I am happy how it is though. It is very loud and I don't think I have heard an 8" midbass that is more powerful than the Dyn. For amps I am running two USAmps 150x's - 150x2@4ohm... One for the Dyn's and one for the HLCD's. The amp that is running the horns is at 0gain and doesn't even get warm to the touch (if you know usamps, you know they run hot when they produce power). The amp running the midbass's is set to produce as much power as it can without clipping, and it gets very warm. That just shows you that you really don't need much power at all to make them extremely loud. I run my setup with the dyns bandpass'd at 69hz on the low end and 1khz on the high end.. The horns then do 1khz and up. To make mine sound smooth, I ended up having to take about 3-7db out from 1.5-4khz with my eq. They were very harsh at least at very high volume levels with it set flat. Supposably they can sound good without any eq, if you work with the install some more than I did. Though I have never heard the above in a vehicle. If I were to do it again, and I had the room... I would do a Dynaudio MW180 in each door with a MW160 in the kick panel and cd2 mh's under the dash. 30rms per horn and like 300+rms per driver.
-------------------- 2005 Black VW Golf TDI Alpine/DEI/Image Dynamics/CDT Posts: 736 | From: Albertville MN USA | Registered: Mar 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
I'm using a pair of Audax PR170M0s as midranges right now, and they sound ALOT like the PHL 1120s from what I've heard, but the PHLs have ALOT more output ablility. How do they sound? Sweetness.
If you want to talk to someone about PHL, go over to www.e-speakers.com and call or email Andre- very nice guy.
-------------------- Team Image Dynamics/Zapco/Werewolf/JK Lab Team Kinetik Sick Bastard Audio SQ Who feels it knows it Posts: 7993 | From: Charlotte,NC USA | Registered: May 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
I was refering to the Illusion and Dynaudio 8s in a completly mid bass situation. I think Im gonna stick with the three way idea. Tguy, how do your dynaudios hold up at high volumes, do they still maintain there SQ?
-------------------- Women are like subs...you gotta break em in before you start pounding them hard. Posts: 175 | From: madison, tn | Registered: Jun 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
also, what do you guys think about Focal drivers, do the make 8s that are for mobile applications?
-------------------- Women are like subs...you gotta break em in before you start pounding them hard. Posts: 175 | From: madison, tn | Registered: Jun 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
You can push the dyn's as hard as they'll go, and they still sound perfect. They are like most people say though, somewhat laid back in the midrange area. They have very powerful lowend/middbass though.
I indeed found the e-speakers.com page last night. I talked to andre.. He convinced me to go with the 3820's... I am going to try to find someone to buy my door panels, so I don't waste all the work I put into them by chopping them up.
I am going to bridge a 150x to each of the 6ohm 3820's ad get a smaller amp for the horns. This should yeild a pretty powerful frontstage I hope. As if it isn't already powerful enough.
Now the question is, how to keep door together better. Have issues with window rattling when its rolled down...
[ 08-21-2002, 12:31 PM: Message edited by: TGuY ]
-------------------- 2005 Black VW Golf TDI Alpine/DEI/Image Dynamics/CDT Posts: 736 | From: Albertville MN USA | Registered: Mar 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
Wow, those 3820s should sound great with the horns, and should play nearly all the way down too. If you could only squeeze those into the kicks...wow...
-------------------- Team Image Dynamics/Zapco/Werewolf/JK Lab Team Kinetik Sick Bastard Audio SQ Who feels it knows it Posts: 7993 | From: Charlotte,NC USA | Registered: May 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
So the Dynaudio 8s would be a good choice for dedicated mid bass. Then what is a good choice for some 6 1/2 mids? Im leaning towards the focal utopia right now. Anyone know about the new CDT Eurosport mid?
-------------------- Women are like subs...you gotta break em in before you start pounding them hard. Posts: 175 | From: madison, tn | Registered: Jun 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
Yah, no way for kicks with the 10... Not without some major cuting... I am going to do them in the doors in the recommended ~.5cf enclosured ported to 80hz... Should be cool.
If you're interested in the Dyn's... I'd say setup just the horns and MW170s.. You'll likely be more than happy with just that setup.
-------------------- 2005 Black VW Golf TDI Alpine/DEI/Image Dynamics/CDT Posts: 736 | From: Albertville MN USA | Registered: Mar 2000
| IP: Logged |
![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
Printer-friendly view of this topic