quote:Originally posted by Kermit the Frog: One issue I have with most of the discussion, is the fixation on what is required to win at National and International.
dB Dragracing is not about accomodating a select number of people who want to win at National and international, It is about promoting autosound competition and having fun.
I can see where Wanye is coming from, He is look more to the masses, whereas most of the conversation is about a select few, who think dB Dragracing should revolve around them.
At the end of the day the people who win are the ones who are using the big overpriced amp, which are not even readily available to the average joe, as what stores actually want to stock them, Alot of the competitors in question don't actually pay that much for them anyways.
This forum needs to loss the ME ME ME mentality and look at it from the prospective of the average joe and his mates trying to have fun.
The average joe does not have multiple KW amps, So why should they be discriminated against when a guy and his mates want to pool their resources and put together a car with several 1kw type amps which is pritty much what most averages joes have.
Going to unlimited amps will open it up abit more for the average joe at the local competition level, which is where the heart of dB dragracing is. Rather than just being the dominated by the guy who has the money to buy a multiple KW amp, that is not every practical in daily driving in the car anyways.
Let the local boys have their fun putting there cars together, competing and having fun with there begged and borrowed setups.
At the end of the day if you want to be competitive at the National and International level as with any thing you need money and the hookups with the suppliers, that is the way it has always generally been. To be at the top of any sport at the international level is an expensive exersize, so just deal with it.
The idea in part of having National and International level competition is to the promote the sport, which is what it should be doing. The rules should be written for the masses, rather than a select few who want to be the best and seem to think that the sport should revolve around them, just because they are at the top.
couldn't have said it any better.
I personally haven't competed much(only been on the sensor 2 times) because of other reasons such as school and money. but I've been browsing this forum for the past year, and from what I see on daily bases all I hear is people bickering about KW amps and world finals. did we all forget about what keeps this sport we call "car audio" alive is the 16-30 age group usually thats the poorest years of everyones life. If we don't find a good way to even out the playing field then I don't see DB drag getting bigger anytime soon. well I'm going to stop ranting because I'm just a "newbie" that wants to have fun/doesn't care about going to world finals.
anyways I feel that rules should stay the same for street B and street C they seen to work pretty good for 04'. But I feel that street A should be ruled like st. B but with 2 10's or one 12".
example Street A 2 10s or 1 12 one big amp or 2 strapped smaller amps. 2 sets of conductors 1 battery
-------------------- 95 dodge Avenger AudioQue HD 12" 2/2 Hifonics 1500D 144.2dB on TermLab
posted
quote by Sid Grice In the athlethic associations, the players get paid to play. When they do not play, they do not get paid.
In this sport of car audio competiton, if the competitors are not allowed to play, they do not suffer financial loss... the organization does.
But then saying that does this sport need ppl like that who cheat and after all would you spend all your time and money and effort to compete just to get banned for cheating.
Posts: 3 | From: UK | Registered: Jun 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Team Urban ArtFX - Percy:
quote:Originally posted by Detlef Hagel: at this rules it is two sides to review. 1 side for the competitor and 1 side for the judge.
1. if you make a size limit, you will see only digital amps, because the digital amps need a many smaller heat sink, and we will see in the future "spl burp amps"
2. if you make a watt limit, it is impossible for the judge to check this, because we have to many manufacturer around the world and some selling only in his country. so all other judges dont know the power rating. our experience says us also, to many manufacturer to cheat with the power rating. and wayne have not the time to check all amps from the world with the power rating.
3. if you make a price limit it is impossible for the judge to check this. we have amps he cost in us 300US$ and in a different country 450US$ or withershins.
for the most db drag competitors and organizer is the street class a beginner class. a normal user dont hear a burp in his car if he drive the car. why we dont make on the db jams volume 8 one track with music for the street class and we messure with the enduro mode maybe 15 or 20 seconds and dont change the rules at the rest (example street a 1 batterie, 2 conductors 1+ and 1-). i think this is easy and fair for the competitor and for the judges. and we dont see 24000 watts, or if he have it, he dont can use it, the batterie give the limit.
thats only one opinion and suggestion
It is not impossible to check the power output. I DON'T KNOW HOW THE JUDGES OVER THERE DO IT BUT the 2Xer's I have been to the judge attached a volt meter with peak hold to the power wire to make sure the voltage does not go over the limit. the only thing that has to be done is have one meter on the speaker wire and a rms amp clamp on the + side of the speaker wire and you can get RMS wattage. It takes less than 3 mins. How is that impossible
oh man 1. if you have 100 competitors at a competition, you need 100 x 3 min = 300 min = 5 hours
2. for a correct messurement for max. power output from the amp, you need a little bit more than a voltmeter. How do you messure the clipping??? You messure at one car with 0,01% and the next car with 10%????? is this fair???? maybe you do it, we not!
3. if you messure at the amp, and the amp is burning out at this moment, what is than?
4. many installation is doing like a show car and it is not easy to conact the terminals .....
thats why i say, it is impossible. Thats the difference between theortical and practice
Like I said before. When a questionable amp comes along test it. Who cares what the thd is, this is DB Drag not a SQ comp. What I'm saying is most of the 1000D 1200D and 1500D amps have well known power outputs thanks to other sanctioning bodies and the ones that are not known can be tested.
quote:Originally posted by BIG RED BASS HEAD: But then saying that does this sport need ppl like that who cheat and after all would you spend all your time and money and effort to compete just to get banned for cheating.
This sport already has counter measures that deals with rule violations. Each year, there are procedures taken in effort to increase participation. To ban, or financially penalize a competitor would be a contradiction to those efforts.
posted
You want a feasible way to test power then here you go.....it is very easy to test two cars per class per comp right? 1st and 2nd place only in Street A, B and C.....after the final round is over test 1st and 2nd place...if 1st fails then he is moved to last place and 2nd is promoted to first and so on....hows that
-------------------- Team TAZM Team Gates Exotic Dreamz Car Club Team Cartunes
If the amp limit will be lifted I have to pay another EXT 3000, both can be strapped together and run with 2 conductors.
Limiting the Amp rule will DOUBLE the costs for most of all Street A competitors, especially here in europe and the difference between European and American competitors will be even larger.
Üüüühh!!! Matze
-------------------- 2002 2nd Place German Champion Street 1-2 2002 3rd Place Champion certified score in the world in Street 1-2 2003 2nd Place German Champion Street A (152.1 dB) 2004 2nd Place ESB Champion Street A 2004 German Champion Street A 2004 EXT 3000 + 2 x Atomic AP10 D1 = 151,2 dB 2005 2nd Place ESB Champion Street A 2005 German Champion Street A Official german cheesecake provider of Alma Gates Posts: 657 | From: Griesheim, Germany | Registered: Mar 2002
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posted
With all the problems in street at finals this year. why not just tell people what amps are acceptable ? Come out with a list of acceptable amps. and update it one or twice a year but besides that keep the rules the same. That way there will be NO CONFUSION about what amp can or can not be used
posted
Im not in that class but if I was I like that idea.
-------------------- TEAM SOUNDSTREAM BASS RACE 06 World Finals Bass Race 6th IASCA World Champion, New World Record 170.1 04 2nd Springbreak Nationals 06 2nd DB Drag World Finals 04 2nd IASCA World Finals 03 9 Al ST. Records Posts: 7486 | From: Dothan Al. | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
Let's not forget that these rules are not just for the handfull of people that go to finals. It would be nice for the average joe to buy a few 1000-1500 watt class d's for $300 a peice and put up a respectable number and place with some of the big guys. There are literally hundreds of competitors that would fall in that category, that have no inkling to go to finals. So let these guys buy the so-called "B" brands for less money and maybe knock off a big guy that has a big "A" brand amp. That's part of the bigger picture.
-------------------- Team Custom Team Quake Team Powermaster Team Ascendant/Fi Posts: 505 | From: Canada | Registered: Oct 2000
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