posted
Alot of people are saying that if you have street, and pro street, that you are adding classes.You aren't adding to the classes at finals,because street wouldn't go, only prostreet.It would cost retailers more for thophies, but if the new guys aren't worried about getting beat, then more might show up,off setting the cost.I also don't think it's fair to put prostreet into a higher class, such as ssnw, because how is that fair? Multiple amps,multiple batts,2-15in. subs,against 2-12in subs,1- amp, 1 battery, this just doesn't add up to me.POints at only multi point event? Everyone knows there aren't alot of those in any one area.And finally,everyone is worried about not enough people in pro street, there would be more than in the extreme classes.I really love to compete, but i don't want to go into debt just to have a "chance" at going to finals,prostreet is the best idea i have seen posted.Thank you for your time.
i dont no the story about the amps on engines (i would like to hear it tho)
they cant get rid of street class ive said this b4 how can 2 10s go against 2 15s ? 140db Vs 150db ? like u would bother going to a nother event if ya got hammed like that i think you need more imput from actual street class competitors because most of u on here are SS+ classes and all use bother saying is get rid of it
i would like to see use all do street class and see how hard it is on a limited budget
as ive said b4 anybody can get 15s loud with $1000 amps not every body can get 12s loud with $200 amps
-------------------- we got 154.9db on tuesday and wrote the car off on wensday
we build extream car now
Posts: 393 | From: Sydney Australia | Registered: Sep 2001
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posted
From all the shows that I went to this year, including the 3X, I saw a grand total of 24 extreme vehicles (some of those at more than one show are counted more than once). These shows were in the Midwest, the heartland for SPL. I have attended more than one show that has had over 20 street 1-2 competitors alone. Now how many of those were serious about going to try to go to finals (not locals just for fun), I would tend to say about half of them. I think there would be a lot more attendance in the Pro Street division at local shows than there would be in Extreme.
I, as a street competitor, and I'm sure most of the others here, would do anything we can to go to finals, short of moving up to SSNW for the full season. I don't care if I have to run SSNW or SS for local shows, or if I have to run Pro Street, or whatever it takes, restriction wise, but I'm sure we'll all do whatever is necessary to see street continue at finals in some shape or form.
-------------------- Team Shedluv Team Sweep Team Kicker Team JBL
quote:Originally posted by Shedluv: I, as a street competitor, and I'm sure most of the others here, would do anything we can to go to finals, short of moving up to SSNW for the full season. I don't care if I have to run SSNW or SS for local shows, or if I have to run Pro Street, or whatever it takes, restriction wise, but I'm sure we'll all do whatever is necessary to see street continue at finals in some shape or form.
Finally a DEDICATED, i'm not gonna whine street competitor. Shedluv, I tip my hat to you.
-------------------- Nate Scholten Team Sounds And Motion SS 1-2 3rd place 2004 finals -THE BUILD- ~Our Drinking Team Has A Stereo Problem~
posted
I think that the street class should be left alone. Many people who love to compete but can't afford big setups can still partake in the street class. If you got rid of street, no kids would ever be able to compete because they don't have near the income of the experienced "old guys". Why get rid of street at the world finals? Are the street competitors really bothering you that much? It's not like 4 million street competitors make it to the finals every year. Street competitors try just as hard if not harder than the rest of the people out there, because they have the least to work with and the most people to go against.
Posts: 2 | Registered: Dec 2001
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quote:Originally posted by ComicalTom888: Street competitors try just as hard if not harder than the rest of the people out there, because they have the least to work with and the most people to go against.
I am sorry, but I heartily disagree. I have built a street car, a super street car and an extreme car. The extreme car took me a year, the super street car took me a month, the street car took me a weekend. Yeah they have to do "less with more"... but the rules apply to everyone... so that isnt really an issue. Also, it may be a heavily populated class, but I would argue that there are more competitive classes than street 1-2, and definitely more competitive classes than street 3-4. You stated your opinion.. i stated mine... I'm not trying to start an argument.
-------------------- Nate Scholten Team Sounds And Motion SS 1-2 3rd place 2004 finals -THE BUILD- ~Our Drinking Team Has A Stereo Problem~
I am sorry, but I heartily disagree. I have built a street car, a super street car and an extreme car. The extreme car took me a year, the super street car took me a month, the street car took me a weekend. Yeah they have to do "less with more"... but the rules apply to everyone... so that isnt really an issue. Also, it may be a heavily populated class, but I would argue that there are more competitive classes than street 1-2, and definitely more competitive classes than street 3-4. You stated your opinion.. i stated mine... I'm not trying to start an argument.
Wait a minute, i have built a street car and me and my teammate are currently building our first extreme car. I am guessing you must not have worked that hard on your first street car? Because i know that i built plenty of different boxes every weekend just to gain another db. I also know alot of people who did the same. Also just because you think there are more competitive classes doesnt mean we should get rid of it. If anything, since the class is more populated that is all the more reason to keep it.
And as for everyone saying that they didnt see that many competitors in street class or dont think there will be many competitors in a pro-street type class, you guys must not have been to the shows that i was attending. I was at a few 1X events that had over 25 street competitors easily. I also met a few competitors who were just starting and i saw them get crushed a couple of times and i also saw them keep coming to events and improve their scores.
I have changed my opinon though, pro-street is still a good idea but i think we should just keep everything the same with a couple of rule changes. I really dont think that there is that many people who actually came to a show, got crushed and decide they will never attend another dbdrag event again. I mean c'mon you either catch the bug or you dont.
-------------------- "TEAM WE BE STROKIN"
164.7DB WITH 2 AMERICAN BASS VFL 1511's, AND 2 SHREDDERS. DID I FORGET TO MENTION THE STOCK ELECTRICAL SYSTEM?
Posts: 272 | From: sandusky,ohio, united states | Registered: May 2001
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posted
Well it's obvious to me that street class is doomed, especially if its left up to the higher class competitors as it is obvious most of them feel street is unneccessary especially at finals.
Needless to say I will no longer be competing in dbdrag racing, I have already paid for my 2002 membership and will just leave that as my last donation to the world of dbdrag racing. I will be moving on to a different org that is better suited to my needs as a competitor. I will probably still attend some of the major events to visit friends.
See ya around. Chris
-------------------- Driven By Sound Team Gates
2004 Spring Break Nationals 3rd Place - Street A
2003 2nd Loudest FL Street A Certified 149.4db 2003 FL State Record Holder
2002 Loudest FL Street 1-2 153.1 db Certified 2002 FL Points Champion Street 1-2 2002 FL State Record Holder 2002 World Finalist
Wait a minute, i have built a street car and me and my teammate are currently building our first extreme car. I am guessing you must not have worked that hard on your first street car? Because i know that i built plenty of different boxes every weekend just to gain another db. I also know alot of people who did the same. Also just because you think there are more competitive classes doesnt mean we should get rid of it. If anything, since the class is more populated that is all the more reason to keep it.
And as for everyone saying that they didnt see that many competitors in street class or dont think there will be many competitors in a pro-street type class, you guys must not have been to the shows that i was attending. I was at a few 1X events that had over 25 street competitors easily. I also met a few competitors who were just starting and i saw them get crushed a couple of times and i also saw them keep coming to events and improve their scores.
I have changed my opinon though, pro-street is still a good idea but i think we should just keep everything the same with a couple of rule changes. I really dont think that there is that many people who actually came to a show, got crushed and decide they will never attend another dbdrag event again. I mean c'mon you either catch the bug or you dont.
what he is saying is that (the many times) he redid his street box's, it only took him a weekend. it shouldnt take you longer. street is 2 12"s 1 amp and a BOX. thats all. if it takes you longer than a weekend to redo that, then youve got some problems. we are talking strictly construction time here..
the extreme car we worked on took many many hours. alot more than a street car.
-------------------- Greg Piper -2002 Mich. Points Champion (172) -2002 dB Drag World Finalist (SS9+) -1997 Ford F-150 -1985 Chevy Astro van
Posts: 3059 | From: Houghton MI | Registered: Oct 2000
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posted
OK -- Try this. How many Street Class competitors on here actually A) bought their equipment from a local retailer in their area and paid a semi-normal price. B) aren't working in the industry?
This is who the real street competitor is.
-------------------- Team Iforgotmypassword
Posts: 9 | From: Jefferson City MO. 65109 | Registered: Aug 2001
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quote:Originally posted by XtremeHonda: Well it's obvious to me that street class is doomed, especially if its left up to the higher class competitors as it is obvious most of them feel street is unneccessary especially at finals.
Needless to say I will no longer be competing in dbdrag racing, I have already paid for my 2002 membership and will just leave that as my last donation to the world of dbdrag racing. I will be moving on to a different org that is better suited to my needs as a competitor. I will probably still attend some of the major events to visit friends.
See ya around. Chris
Why quit??
Why not help solve the problem here the street class Dilemma.....
I think what we need on this forum is guys who compete for fun putting their input in on this......
What do the guys with 300 watt amps and 2 12" subs want to do???
Why not conduct surveys in all the stores???
That way it is absolute non prejudice......
We have to ask the people its concerning......
-------------------- Team Beyond Audio Team FX AUDIO Ben DelGrosso 8th in the world SS 1-2 no wall 2001
2 Beyond Audio Inhuman 18's for 2002 Thanks to Donald Hebig, Ray Choy, Rob Oszust, RW Audio and Crossfire.
Posts: 400 | From: Sherwood Park, Alberta | Registered: Jun 2001
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quote:Originally posted by ASEKent: OK -- Try this. How many Street Class competitors on here actually A) bought their equipment from a local retailer in their area and paid a semi-normal price. B) aren't working in the industry?
This is who the real street competitor is.
The problem is also is if a customer approaches a store and says he wants to compete most likely there gonna get a good price because there promoting a store.
Its the way it is.......
-------------------- Team Beyond Audio Team FX AUDIO Ben DelGrosso 8th in the world SS 1-2 no wall 2001
2 Beyond Audio Inhuman 18's for 2002 Thanks to Donald Hebig, Ray Choy, Rob Oszust, RW Audio and Crossfire.
Posts: 400 | From: Sherwood Park, Alberta | Registered: Jun 2001
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posted
My opinion is,no change the divisions,In my country we created a Mini Street division the last year with 1 sub 10 inch 1sub 12 and 1 sub 15 inches,with 600watts rms amplifiers ( HIS IS THE NEW BLOOD), and combined the Extreme divisions ext 1-8 subs and 9+ subs.
I am sorry, but I heartily disagree. I have built a street car, a super street car and an extreme car. The extreme car took me a year, the super street car took me a month, the street car took me a weekend. Yeah they have to do "less with more"... but the rules apply to everyone... so that isnt really an issue. Also, it may be a heavily populated class, but I would argue that there are more competitive classes than street 1-2, and definitely more competitive classes than street 3-4. You stated your opinion.. i stated mine... I'm not trying to start an argument.
posted
My stereo I went out to a store and dropped $1700cnd on subs and an amp, I built a box and wentout and got my arse handed to me by guy who boght stuff for 1/4 of the price I did, that discouraged me like you would not believe....so I made another box got a little louder and yet again got spanked like a circus mule....so owuld this make me a REAL street competitor?
I think having a pro street and beginnerstreet class would be the best bet.
-------------------- formaly known as Bassmecha
The Dukk says: Know your bass: PORT your damn box!!
posted
I Have been competing in DBDRA for three years but just here and there! Not winning didnt keep me away, it sucked me in because I want to win! To get loud! So this year I'm goin for the finals! Also I havent seen a 13+ extreme car at a show yet! Now I don't go to many but I always see tons of street cars! Also Pro street is a good deal! When people say if there are more trofies then shops will back out due to cost and a street competitor says well get rid of extreme 13+ everyone says that isn' gona work because there might only be 1 pro street guy at a competition! Well how many times has there been ony one extreme 13+ guy at a competition! It seems to me that some of the "big boys" are trying to say if street isn't perfect then dump it! well if you take a long hard look at the other classes you would see there not perfect as well! Now I know they are closer but look at the extreme classes a year or two back! what I'm trying to say is there will always be some problem some were! We need to weed out the abusive members with rules and team work! Dumping a class from the finals is a easy out that will bite you in the ass later. The fact is you could turn street class into 3 diferent classes and the would still be bigger the extreme 13+! I dont meen to sound like I picking on extreme class or anyone for that matter, I am just trying to make a point! thank you, Zac
-------------------- Posts: 1074 | From: Ione, CA | Registered: Dec 2001
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posted
well i can Almost consider myself a REAL Street Competitor i bought my sub form a local retailer and I am using amps made in the mid 90's cause i picked em up cheap USED a while ago the are second gen Orion HCCA's there on the 6th gen now.
I hope next year i can compete at a lil higher level with either one or 2 subs. I wish I had an answer for the delema but i feel every year we will go through this same thing, one way to keep the newbies from getting killed is to make street competitors play a SONG through there system have 2-3 bass tracks on next years dB drag vol 5 disk to be used on street vehicals to where the track would have to be played in the persons car during the metering prosses have it be tracks 10-13 and let the track played up to the judges discresion that way no one would be able to build a ONE NOTE WONDER BOX, and have 300 amps of current drawn from there electrical system. does anyone get what im saying? anyone agree, also just make this a RULE at 2x and 3x events or only certified events. theres some other things that need to be changed too but they have allready been stated.
Bryan
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Posts: 125 | From: Vancouver, WA, USA | Registered: May 2001
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what he is saying is that (the many times) he redid his street box's, it only took him a weekend. it shouldnt take you longer. street is 2 12"s 1 amp and a BOX. thats all. if it takes you longer than a weekend to redo that, then youve got some problems. we are talking strictly construction time here..
the extreme car we worked on took many many hours. alot more than a street car.
I understand this. I have been currently working on my own extreme car for over a year now. All i am saying is that street competitors just dont throw a box together and nail a 153. There is alot of competitors out there that work hard on their street cars and deserve to have a finals. Just because they dont work as a extreme car builder would does not mean we should get rid of the class. Street is a huge majority of this sport, that is all the more reason to keep it.
Keep street the same.
-------------------- "TEAM WE BE STROKIN"
164.7DB WITH 2 AMERICAN BASS VFL 1511's, AND 2 SHREDDERS. DID I FORGET TO MENTION THE STOCK ELECTRICAL SYSTEM?
Posts: 272 | From: sandusky,ohio, united states | Registered: May 2001
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posted
for the many people who claim that people in street do not deserve to be at finals or how there is no need for street ... well it seems to me that it brings the most competition and the hardest competition even to the point of discussing the rules ... 9 pages omg ..... the fact is this if the people who would compeate as a non pro but is one... they will have to be a person of non pride ... i have very much pride in the classes i compeate in and if i got a sponcer i would gladly go to the "pro" ranks its about pride.
-------------------- Posts: 2102 | From: odenton, md , usa | Registered: May 1999
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posted
Well regardless of the outcome of the new 2002 rule changes i will be competing, cuz i am hooked. Wether it is in a revized Street, Pro Street or even SS No wall even though i do not have the $$ or the knowlage to compete with the "big boys" as of yet. The way i see it after reading this thread, the one thing we can agree opon is that a power limmet of some sort is needed in street class, for Example,
1500wts in Street 1-2 3000wts in 3-4 or 2000wts in 1-2(the best idea IMO) 4000wts in 3-4(" ")
Also the issue of the under hood amps and box placment in the in the mini vans. We all seem to agree oppon the last two.
[ 12-19-2001: Message edited by: donaldm ]
-------------------- Team TAZM Team Gates Exotic Dreamz Car Club Team Cartunes
quote:Originally posted by Q: As long as there is a fundamental contradiction in terms, ie: full range 'nubie-Street' systems competing within a 'one-note' format, there will always be serious dB level and fairness issues.
This is why having a real nubie 'Street' class at finals cannot both work and be fair.
For the better part of 2 seasons it has been obvious to many that the need for a more balanced 'ship' is needed within the ranks and classes of the sport, especially at the lower level classes.
Look at the scores from finals and you will see a very similar score for most of the classes - all very near that 168dB - 172dB mark, and yet there are TEN NON-STREET CLASSES?
Competition is competition whether it's a deck power & 6x9 class, or a 48,000 watt/48 woofer class - the spirit/idea is the same, competition by good competitors within the class - whatever that class may be.
Therefore I believe in fewer classes in SS and Extreme - (1 woofer/2-4 woofers/5+...?) and more so called 'Street' classes where the size and number of woofers, batteries, channels of amplification, and enclosure/interior modifications are designed in such a way that the newer/less wealthy competitor, and the competitor who isn't willing to permanently destroy the vehicles interior, may also have a forum for World Finals level competition.
The reason, in my opinion, that the Street classes are so popular is because of the more friendly cost, and enforced limitations within those classes, which, for many of us only ADD to the challenge.
As far as a newbie class, there should be a class where the newbie competitor can compete for the local trophy, and, (for members only!) internet points/standing ie: State, country, and world internet standing, but no finals, and no 2nd season competitors for the very bottom (nubie) class which should be something like a 3-10", 2-12", 1-15" woofer class, and current 'STREET' limitations as far as electrical system, enclosure location, normal seats, and so on...
And drop any amplifier limitation for the nubie class - they are already limited by the electrical system, just allow a total of 2 batteries, and let them fight it out regarding amplifiers, without finals, this class will be dominated by some real STREET pounders, and not one note wonders - especially if they must play a music cd, instead of a tone cd.
I believe this would bring the 'old school' fun back into the local level, and offer more 'interim' classes for those (of us) unwilling/unable to compete on a 170dB+ SS/Extreme level.
AND MORE 12" WOOFER CLASSES!!
Sorry, I know, ...another book!
I dont think the SS guys will go for this but limiting the number of ss classeswould open up for more classes for the majority of competitors ie.street beaters.. so they dont have to go agianst guys like Q doing 151+ with a single 12. but he cant play music through that box.. the sub will blow up..by combining thee ss classes it should help the sport greatly.. it seems like a GREAT idea to me.. later Doug
posted
i've benn sitting here reading for over an hour now,ALL 9 PAGES,every post.the people who don't seem to want street at finals are not even in street.i'm a ss competitor myself,but my 15 yr old son is a VERY COMPETITIVE street person(he is the s3-4 champion for 2001).he is not a pro but EVERY WEEK he took his paycheck and entered a db drag SOMEWHERE.he got spanked all year by andy ruach and leallen lockhart,both who finished in the top 4 at finals,but he NEVER quit.he had a TRUE street vehicle built in the driveway,not by a shop.i paid for every peice of equipment in his vehicle and mine(good prices but you price 6 9.0s and tell me we arent dedicated).if it werent for street he wouldnt have ever started competing or me for that matter.street is where it all begins,if you eliminate street,DB DRAG WILL DECLINE NATIONALLY.leave it alone.all of his freinds cant wait till their cars are finished and the season begins.they are all around 16-17 years old and are spending every penny they get on equipment.they figure if jon can win a championship,so can they.why take that dream away.they all know it takes alot of dedication,they watched how much work and effort went in to building a simple little street vehicle and they are wiling to TRY,and that should count for something.sorry i wrote so much but somebody needs to defend the street guys because it does take JUST AS MUCH DEDICATION to compete in street as it does in ANY OTHER CLASS.once again,lets LEAVE STREET ALONE.anybody ever heard of the word "CONSISTANCY".people ARE GOING TO CRY REGAURDLESS.thanks for hearing me out andsorry i dont know how to do the stats thing,but this is my real name if you want check my stats and see exactly how dedicated i am.my son is jon fischer if you'd like to see how dedicated this 15 yr old STREET competitor is,and he did pay for EVERY EVENT he entered,food,gas,lodging,etc.
-------------------- Proud member of BROKEN SILENCE COMPETITION CLUB Team PSI Team DBDRIVE Team DBLINK Team DBDRIVEN Team Ohio Generators Team MAXXSONICS 11X WORLD RECORD HOLDER(builder of a few others) ITS NOT WHAT YOU BUY, ITS WHAT YOU BUILD! Posts: 735 | From: missouri | Registered: Aug 2001
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posted
Keep all classes the same.Have street at finals and add 1 class just at the local levels. Call it Mini Street. That class would be for the guy who wants to see what he hits or buddies who want to go head to head. It will be up to whoever holds dbdrag to see who will go in this class or not. This way Street competers will still get points for single point events. A simple way to fix a big problem in my opinion.
First, thanks for the tons of input. I also appreciate the professional manner in which this topic has been discussed.
We are currently soliciting input from many, many retailers and manufacturers regarding this issue.
Preliminary results look as though we may keep the Street division at Finals. There will probably be a reduction in classes at the top end (Extreme) and maybe in SS. There may be an expansion in SS NW. If we reduce the classes in any division, we will probably invite the same number of competitors in those divisions as before.
There will probably be as many as 4 NEW amateur classes which will not be at Finals. Classes may be based on cone area and amp qty instead of woofer count. (May be similar to MSD) Points will be accumulated but will not count towards Finals qualification.
We are very busy with this. All of the 3X judges are working these issues and discussing topics with local retailers in their area. We are communicating with everyone here at the dBDRA. Thousands of emails have been sent to the field.
Thanks for your patience and participation. I will keep you posted as these discussions start to bear fruit.
-------------------- "Keep it Loud and Make me Proud!"
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