-------------------- 2006 Bass Race 149.9 World Finals 2nd place H.O. Alts FI If you dont like what I have to say, just contact Boomingcreation he will erase it for you Posts: 16153 | From: tx | Registered: Dec 2003
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What is funny? There are a few companys that I know are willing to help.
-------------------- TEAM SOUNDSTREAM BASS RACE 06 World Finals Bass Race 6th IASCA World Champion, New World Record 170.1 04 2nd Springbreak Nationals 06 2nd DB Drag World Finals 04 2nd IASCA World Finals 03 9 Al ST. Records Posts: 7486 | From: Dothan Al. | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
this is exactly why i supported bass race since last year when sam was first testing it.
i competed in the FIRST THREE bass race events he held, and thought it was just plain awesome!
i knew eventually manufactures and retailers would grab onto it like a pit bull. it increases sales for both, by appealing to the REAL street beaters. the average joe, who's never even HEARD of a burp before. but he knows what 2 yellow tops in his trunk can do with a few amps and subs.
NO ONE sits at the car wash, and burps. they wang. and try to outdo each other.
this season, i tried to go all out on my sm 1-2 setup, so i had to sacrifice music. but, next season, my truck is for sm1-2 and my car is for bass race
still trying to work a way to toss a bass race system in my truck too. even if its the lower classes. that way i can actually enjoy daily driving my truck as well!
-------------------- Team Maxxsonics . Kinetik Power Maxxsonics Team Captain 2005 WF SM 1-2 6th place 2006 WF SM 1-2 4th Place : U.S. Points 3rd w/315 points : SPLMax Competitor of the Year. 2007 WF SM 1-2 4th Place : U.S. Points 9th w/215 points : Top U.S. SM 1-2 certified score. 2007 Usaci State Records : Mod 2001-4000 : Mod 4000-up : Port Wars Open : Street Beat 4. 2008 Sold the nissan and took a break to build a new minitruck. 2009 Coming back with Bass Race & Psychlone in the minitruck.
quote:Originally posted by boommerextreme: What is funny? There are a few companys that I know are willing to help.
my bad i wasnt paying attention about the second page and ment to quote this and then laugh
quote:Originally posted by ---Navi---: "iuno, kinda looks more like a pitbull in a jar of mayo to me"
-------------------- 2006 Bass Race 149.9 World Finals 2nd place H.O. Alts FI If you dont like what I have to say, just contact Boomingcreation he will erase it for you Posts: 16153 | From: tx | Registered: Dec 2003
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posted
Ok I was just looking at it like what is funny. I was LOL
-------------------- TEAM SOUNDSTREAM BASS RACE 06 World Finals Bass Race 6th IASCA World Champion, New World Record 170.1 04 2nd Springbreak Nationals 06 2nd DB Drag World Finals 04 2nd IASCA World Finals 03 9 Al ST. Records Posts: 7486 | From: Dothan Al. | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
Potential problems with Bass Race from a manufacturers point of view:
-Having the ability to choose your own music is little more than a glorified one note wonder vehicle. Smart competitors tune their vehicle to hit for one particular song, which is not a true representation of the musicality of the system.
-Reaction time plays too big of a part in the format, thus removing their product from being the deciding factor and negating any real advertising publicity they may seek to gain through support of the format. If Brand A can loose to Brand B simply because they were slower to react, where is the benefit to the manufacturer?
-Measurement system does not read the entire audio spectrum, only below 80 or 100Hz and is therefore not a representation of the musicality of the equipment. It also brings back into consideration the issue of musical choice, and tuning of the vehicle perform best on that one song.
So is this to say that manufacturers are not interested, NO WAY! However it is to say that it will make the possibilities for greater diversity of manufacturer involvement less likely. In other words the ones to initially hop on board would be the ones who are already supporting typical SPL competitions.
What can be done to entice further manufacturer involvement?
-Perhaps have the competitors choice of music for their qualifying rounds. Then when eliminations begin have three songs which are required to be used. In otherwords for round one all 8 competitors have to use the round one song (eg. Flashdance), round two all 4 competitors again use the same song (eg. Lil' Jon) and for the final round the last 2 competitors both use the same song (eg. 1812 Overture). The trick would be to find three songs that would really test the audio systems ability to play a wide variety of music, not just finding a song with strong 60Hz information.
-Eliminate the reaction time portion. Maybe have a 5 second countdown within which the audio systems start playing, then measure and average over the next 30 seconds. This would then prove that the equipment is the hero for it's ability to play loud and long. Far better from a manufacturer's point of view.
-Perhaps some form of arbitrary judged score for the over-all tonal balance of the system. The judges would award say a 0.0 - 1.0dB bonus for the over-all ability of the system's mids and highs to keep up with the bass.
Just playing Devil's advocate here but these are some of the more relevant issues I can come up with.
PS. The trick to sponsorship is not figuring out what equipment you want, but rather in figuring out what the manufacturer will gain by giving you the equipment, otherwise what's the point for them, right? Make it worth their while to sponsor you!
-------------------- I'm so happy, Cuz today I found my friends, They're in my head. Posts: 130 | From: Melbourne, Australia | Registered: Jun 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Scott Neill: Potential problems with Bass Race from a manufacturers point of view:
-Having the ability to choose your own music is little more than a glorified one note wonder vehicle. Smart competitors tune their vehicle to hit for one particular song, which is not a true representation of the musicality of the system.
-Reaction time plays too big of a part in the format, thus removing their product from being the deciding factor and negating any real advertising publicity they may seek to gain through support of the format. If Brand A can loose to Brand B simply because they were slower to react, where is the benefit to the manufacturer?
-Measurement system does not read the entire audio spectrum, only below 80 or 100Hz and is therefore not a representation of the musicality of the equipment. It also brings back into consideration the issue of musical choice, and tuning of the vehicle perform best on that one song.
So is this to say that manufacturers are not interested, NO WAY! However it is to say that it will make the possibilities for greater diversity of manufacturer involvement less likely. In other words the ones to initially hop on board would be the ones who are already supporting typical SPL competitions.
What can be done to entice further manufacturer involvement?
-Perhaps have the competitors choice of music for their qualifying rounds. Then when eliminations begin have three songs which are required to be used. In otherwords for round one all 8 competitors have to use the round one song (eg. Flashdance), round two all 4 competitors again use the same song (eg. Lil' Jon) and for the final round the last 2 competitors both use the same song (eg. 1812 Overture). The trick would be to find three songs that would really test the audio systems ability to play a wide variety of music, not just finding a song with strong 60Hz information.
-Eliminate the reaction time portion. Maybe have a 5 second countdown within which the audio systems start playing, then measure and average over the next 30 seconds. This would then prove that the equipment is the hero for it's ability to play loud and long. Far better from a manufacturer's point of view.
-Perhaps some form of arbitrary judged score for the over-all tonal balance of the system. The judges would award say a 0.0 - 1.0dB bonus for the over-all ability of the system's mids and highs to keep up with the bass.
Just playing Devil's advocate here but these are some of the more relevant issues I can come up with.
PS. The trick to sponsorship is not figuring out what equipment you want, but rather in figuring out what the manufacturer will gain by giving you the equipment, otherwise what's the point for them, right? Make it worth their while to sponsor you!
I think you left out on thing
INSTALL!!!!
Install plays the biggest part in how loud or how good a system sounds. The Idea of the better product will win is just not true.
When you see a drag race reaction time plays a bug part of who wins, When you watch NASCAR driver reaction plays a big part.
quote:Originally posted by Scott Neill: Potential problems with Bass Race from a manufacturers point of view:
-Having the ability to choose your own music is little more than a glorified one note wonder vehicle. Smart competitors tune their vehicle to hit for one particular song, which is not a true representation of the musicality of the system.
-Reaction time plays too big of a part in the format, thus removing their product from being the deciding factor and negating any real advertising publicity they may seek to gain through support of the format. If Brand A can loose to Brand B simply because they were slower to react, where is the benefit to the manufacturer?
-Measurement system does not read the entire audio spectrum, only below 80 or 100Hz and is therefore not a representation of the musicality of the equipment. It also brings back into consideration the issue of musical choice, and tuning of the vehicle perform best on that one song.
So is this to say that manufacturers are not interested, NO WAY! However it is to say that it will make the possibilities for greater diversity of manufacturer involvement less likely. In other words the ones to initially hop on board would be the ones who are already supporting typical SPL competitions.
What can be done to entice further manufacturer involvement?
-Perhaps have the competitors choice of music for their qualifying rounds. Then when eliminations begin have three songs which are required to be used. In otherwords for round one all 8 competitors have to use the round one song (eg. Flashdance), round two all 4 competitors again use the same song (eg. Lil' Jon) and for the final round the last 2 competitors both use the same song (eg. 1812 Overture). The trick would be to find three songs that would really test the audio systems ability to play a wide variety of music, not just finding a song with strong 60Hz information.
-Eliminate the reaction time portion. Maybe have a 5 second countdown within which the audio systems start playing, then measure and average over the next 30 seconds. This would then prove that the equipment is the hero for it's ability to play loud and long. Far better from a manufacturer's point of view.
-Perhaps some form of arbitrary judged score for the over-all tonal balance of the system. The judges would award say a 0.0 - 1.0dB bonus for the over-all ability of the system's mids and highs to keep up with the bass.
Just playing Devil's advocate here but these are some of the more relevant issues I can come up with.
PS. The trick to sponsorship is not figuring out what equipment you want, but rather in figuring out what the manufacturer will gain by giving you the equipment, otherwise what's the point for them, right? Make it worth their while to sponsor you!
i find a couple flaws in your reasoning.... like flashdance. its the past, let it go.
as for a standardizing muzic selection, i doubt that will hold manufacturers back. After all, they are going to promote the winner as the loudest street beatin stereo around, not the loudest street beating stereo using lil john, so i doubt that the music selection will make a difference. also remember that these kids dont go around listening to the same music, so they will compete with what they like to listen to.
as for the full spectrum measuring, i think we should leave that part to the sq guys. i think we need audible highs and mids, but anything more than just being audible and clear, you start reaching into the sq side of competition.
i do agree that the average should start with the first sound made with the stereo, so that you leave reaction time out of it, it basis the score on the system only.
the point where manufacturers are watching is because a streetable system is the 99% of the business they do. If you really think they make tons of money off specialized spl only woofers that sell to 1% of the market, you got another guess coming. Bass Race conforms to the other 99% of their product, and the reason the product was made in the first place, to make loud/clean music. Heck, i think crossfire is getting rid of the 4000d cuz they dont sell to consumers. Just food for thought there....
While bass race might not be the answer, its definately a big step in the right direction.
-------------------- "14 is like the new 20" Posts: 9269 | From: over yonder | Registered: May 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Hakeeb: I think you left out on thing
INSTALL!!!!
Install plays the biggest part in how loud or how good a system sounds. The Idea of the better product will win is just not true.
When you see a drag race reaction time plays a bug part of who wins, When you watch NASCAR driver reaction plays a big part.
Good point!
What I was attempting to refer to though is not necessarily the technical issues of the sport but rather the way in which manufacturers view it. Is this correct, most probably not, but never the less this is how it is viewed by some manufacturers. Also to address that point I would assume that any manufacturer worth their salt would invest in technical research of making their product perform to it's utmost potential...
I still stand firm on the point of view regarding the reaction time however, far too much chance involved not necessarily technical skill of design or manufacturing.
quote:Originally posted by HCCAfan is back: i find a couple flaws in your reasoning.... like flashdance. its the past, let it go.
as for a standardizing muzic selection, i doubt that will hold manufacturers back. After all, they are going to promote the winner as the loudest street beatin stereo around, not the loudest street beating stereo using lil john, so i doubt that the music selection will make a difference. also remember that these kids dont go around listening to the same music, so they will compete with what they like to listen to.
as for the full spectrum measuring, i think we should leave that part to the sq guys. i think we need audible highs and mids, but anything more than just being audible and clear, you start reaching into the sq side of competition.
i do agree that the average should start with the first sound made with the stereo, so that you leave reaction time out of it, it basis the score on the system only.
the point where manufacturers are watching is because a streetable system is the 99% of the business they do. If you really think they make tons of money off specialized spl only woofers that sell to 1% of the market, you got another guess coming. Bass Race conforms to the other 99% of their product, and the reason the product was made in the first place, to make loud/clean music. Heck, i think crossfire is getting rid of the 4000d cuz they dont sell to consumers. Just food for thought there....
While bass race might not be the answer, its definately a big step in the right direction.
I Whole heartedly agree that Bass Race is definately a step in the right direction!!!
What I really wanted to do is attempt to get people (competitors) to start trying to think the way that manufacturers think. Is this the right way, probably not 100% but never the less it is how some of the people outside the competitive lanes see it.
As for Flashdance LOL I knew that would get a rise out of people!!! I think my main point was that there needs to be a way to make it even MORE about the musicality. By allowing individual choice of music it opens the door to exploiting the musical selection into becoming little more than a glorified test tone. For example to find the perfect Bass Mekanik song with two main notes that my vehicle hits at, then build the vehicle accordingly. There needs to be some form of randomization of the music played so that it shows the true musical versatility of the system, THAT WOULD BE TRULY IMPRESSIVE!!!
As to the point of full frequency measurement, yeah I agree that this is too SQ oriented but the point being that 80Hz and down is still only a subwoofer competition. What is the answer for this? Point for musical balance? System RTA? I dunno but do you see the point?
For example if something like Pipo's truck can play anything you throw at it and sound musical, DAMN!
So come on guys, we need more ideas to really push this thing forwards into the mainstream, not just defensive banter saying why it's already good.
Let's build it into something AWESOME!!!
/Me stirs the pot a little more
-------------------- I'm so happy, Cuz today I found my friends, They're in my head. Posts: 130 | From: Melbourne, Australia | Registered: Jun 2002
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quote:Originally posted by SPLMAX -- Sam: I believe "artist" and "recording companies" are manufacturers also? Do they not manufacture music?
Exactly, so isn't it the best option to also support them by finding a way to randomize the music in order to ensure that as wide of a selection is used by each competitor as possible?
I don't know the logisitcs of how this could be made to work, but it is a very interesting idea...
Supports the musicality of the system and promotes the recording industry by having an extensive assortment of media being played.
-------------------- I'm so happy, Cuz today I found my friends, They're in my head. Posts: 130 | From: Melbourne, Australia | Registered: Jun 2002
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posted
i see all your points, and agree to an extent.
but.. i also see it like this...
its called BASS RACE.. .ie: BASS.
not musical race.
manufacturers who choose to support cars that play good musical selection.....enter meca, iasca, usaci.
loud bass. dbdrag & bass race.
i'm not knockin all your ideas, i think they are valid. but, not for THIS particular format.
everyone doesnt build thier bass race vehicle for one song. some have a wide range of music. some use a different song at every event. most of the locals, just pop in whatever they fancy at the moment, and are winning while doing it.
reaction time is one of the most important aspects of this format.
just because the guy next to you has 16 - 12's and 40kw in amps, against your 2 10's and 500 watts.. does NOT mean he is going to win.
quite often the guy with the smaller system will end up winning.
this is exactly what the "locals" needed.
nevermind street class, or throwin locals into walled classes because thier system was an inch too high above the window.
they are locals. they play music.
i know of at LEAST 20 people in ohio, between last year and this year, that got started BECAUSE of bass race... and then got more involved with dbdrag, as a result.
-------------------- Team Maxxsonics . Kinetik Power Maxxsonics Team Captain 2005 WF SM 1-2 6th place 2006 WF SM 1-2 4th Place : U.S. Points 3rd w/315 points : SPLMax Competitor of the Year. 2007 WF SM 1-2 4th Place : U.S. Points 9th w/215 points : Top U.S. SM 1-2 certified score. 2007 Usaci State Records : Mod 2001-4000 : Mod 4000-up : Port Wars Open : Street Beat 4. 2008 Sold the nissan and took a break to build a new minitruck. 2009 Coming back with Bass Race & Psychlone in the minitruck.
posted
Yea I have a lot of subs and lost..... HEHEHHE
-------------------- TEAM SOUNDSTREAM BASS RACE 06 World Finals Bass Race 6th IASCA World Champion, New World Record 170.1 04 2nd Springbreak Nationals 06 2nd DB Drag World Finals 04 2nd IASCA World Finals 03 9 Al ST. Records Posts: 7486 | From: Dothan Al. | Registered: Mar 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Team Urban ArtFX - PornStar: i see all your points, and agree to an extent.
but.. i also see it like this...
its called BASS RACE.. .ie: BASS.
not musical race.
manufacturers who choose to support cars that play good musical selection.....enter meca, iasca, usaci.
loud bass. dbdrag & bass race.
i'm not knockin all your ideas, i think they are valid. but, not for THIS particular format.
everyone doesnt build thier bass race vehicle for one song. some have a wide range of music. some use a different song at every event. most of the locals, just pop in whatever they fancy at the moment, and are winning while doing it.
reaction time is one of the most important aspects of this format.
just because the guy next to you has 16 - 12's and 40kw in amps, against your 2 10's and 500 watts.. does NOT mean he is going to win.
quite often the guy with the smaller system will end up winning.
this is exactly what the "locals" needed.
nevermind street class, or throwin locals into walled classes because thier system was an inch too high above the window.
they are locals. they play music.
i know of at LEAST 20 people in ohio, between last year and this year, that got started BECAUSE of bass race... and then got more involved with dbdrag, as a result.
I get the point about it being 'Bass Race' by name but in the way it is portrayed through action and definition it's really attempting to be about bringing music back into the sport. Now is this to say critical listening in a totally silent environment at volume levels well below 130dB Heck No!
Consumers want LOUD MUSIC! They don't want loud SPL one note wonder cars (although I sure love building them) and they don't necessarily want critical listening low volume systems either. The predominance of MP3's and iPod's attest to this fact.
What do they want? The loudest streetbeater, groundpounder on their block! They want to feel the bass and still be able to sing along to the lyrics.
If the goal is truly to increase manufacturer support for this very promising format then there are a few things that need to be considered.
It has to be about MUSIC, not just Bass or else it's just another in the multitude of SPL competitions.
It has to be a format of competition where the skill in equipment manufacture, selection and installation take precedence. If the day can be won or lost because of something as petty as reaction time then it's an unsafe risk for manufacturers to hang their hats on.
This might not bee what people want to hear but it is the smple truth for growing this into the truly widespread format that it has the potential to become...
We're talking about attempting to get manufacturers involved who are NOT traditionally attracted to SPL competitions. In other words we need to GROW manufacturer involvement not just shift the current manufacturer's in a new direction. With this in mind we need to consider why there is not the support for SPL competitions that there could be.
hopefully I have alluded to the reasons why support is not more widespread, take it for what it is. I for one would LOVe to see this grow from being a simple enthusiast format to being something HUGE!
Nuff Said
[ 11-11-2005, 08:11 AM: Message edited by: Scott Neill ]
-------------------- I'm so happy, Cuz today I found my friends, They're in my head. Posts: 130 | From: Melbourne, Australia | Registered: Jun 2002
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posted
Reaction time is what gives Bass Race its edege. Think about it Anybody can press teh button on the loudest db drag cars and not mess up. Knowing how hard to push a system well that is all in the Driver . Look at it this way in Nascar all the car bodies are identical all the engines are almost the same what makes the difference? Driver!!! That is where Bass Race will get spectator draw. They will like certain drivers and how they compete and show for the crowd. Look at it this way A sport without fans/spectators is just a hobby. Do you know Jeff Gordon or Dale Ernheart or are you all about the chevy body with the custom built engine?
-------------------- A real Street Beater not built just for the meter. Ground Pound!
quote:Originally posted by Scott Neill: I get the point about it being 'Bass Race' by name, but in the way it is portrayed through action and definition, it's really attempting to be about bringing music back into the sport. Now is this to say critical listening in a totally silent environment at volume levels well below 130dB Heck No!
Consumers want LOUD MUSIC!
What do they want? The loudest streetbeater, groundpounder on their block! They want to feel the bass and still be able to sing along to the lyrics.
It has to be about MUSIC, not just Bass or else it's just another in the multitude of SPL competitions.
I for one would LOVE to see this grow from being a simple enthusiast format to being something HUGE!
Nuff Said
And well said also! LOUD Complete Audio Systems.
That's been the way I have represented since 1989 to this very day.
-------------------- RF Vintage Old School Fanatic, The Punch Car Audio for the dedicated sound enthusiast with a passion for performance!! Cerwin Vega! Turn It Up! Since 1954. 50(more)years of disturbing the peace! -----------------------------------
posted
So what vehicles would you think would have an advantage of a "Bass Race" would it basically be the same kind of cars that do well with SPL. CRX's and ect...
Posts: 17 | From: Amarillo | Registered: Oct 2005
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posted
Bass Race is not SQ we don't need flasndance or Fresh Air is about been LOUD, having control of your system and most important about having FUN. I think there is a lot of manufactures that will support BASS RACE regarless of what music we play.
No offense to anyone just my .02
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Team Powermasters Team Ascendant Audio Team Cactus Sound Posts: 3210 | From: Orlando | Registered: Oct 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Pipo: Bass Race is not SQ
SQ/SPL combined (SQL/SQPL)
-------------------- RF Vintage Old School Fanatic, The Punch Car Audio for the dedicated sound enthusiast with a passion for performance!! Cerwin Vega! Turn It Up! Since 1954. 50(more)years of disturbing the peace! -----------------------------------
quote:Originally posted by Pipo: Bass Race is not SQ we don't need flasndance or Fresh Air is about been LOUD, having control of your system and most important about having FUN. I think there is a lot of manufactures that will support BASS RACE regarless of what music we play.
No offense to anyone just my .02
Unfortunately I haven't had an opportunity to hear your truck in person yet Pipo, but from the videos I've seen, the coolest thing about it is that it is painfully LOUD and yet you can still hear the music too!
That's the only point I'm trying to make is to attempt to negate the advantages of the one note systems and really drive home the fact that these systems will take your head off with MUSIC!
I agree that Flashdance is NOT the answer LOL, I just mentioned that to make a point and get people's attention.
Also to mention once again, I'm not arguing that manufacturers will get involved in the format. What I am saying is that if Bass Race wants to attract manufacturers who don't normally get involved then things need to progress a little bit further. This way Bass Race could actually expand the number of manufacturers by getting new ones involved, AS WELL AS bringing along those manufacturers who are already a part of dB Drag Racing.
-------------------- I'm so happy, Cuz today I found my friends, They're in my head. Posts: 130 | From: Melbourne, Australia | Registered: Jun 2002
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